Alex Sanfilippo: The Mind Behind PodMatch's Success

Chris Stone [: 00:00:01

Please welcome the host of the top rated podcast called Podcasting Made Simple, and also the founder of podpros.com, a software company focused specifically on the podcasting industry, including this massively popular service called PodMatch. Please welcome to the show, mister Alex Santalupo. Welcome, sir.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:00:24

You guys, thank you so much. I've been, like, backstage laughing while I was drinking your orange juice and eating your cookies because, one, I got those things. Thank you for sending them in the mail, by the way, so I could have them backstage at home.

Chris Stone [: 00:00:36

Time. Prime delivery.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:00:37

What I'm thankful for is is both of you. Like, really thankful to be here today. You guys are experts at what you do. I I've been just consuming the show from a podcast stand standpoint, but, really just honored to be here with you guys.

Chris Stone [: 00:00:49

Well, thank you so

Jim Fuhs [: 00:00:50

much. Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:00:51

Yeah. Alex, it you know, you, I you have done this probably more than anyone, and I you know, we always talk to people. We always talk to podcasters, whether guests or hosts, is is how do I get better? How do I develop? You know? And everyone does a lot of consumption. Right? They're consuming us right now. They're either listening and or watching, us right now, and that consumption is great. It's great to learn this stuff. It's great to learn to to read books, but it's really about the action. Right? It's a it's so if you go back and have you ever gone back and listened to your first podcast you ever did?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:01:25

Yeah. I mean, I I don't know if I'd do it again. It was a painful experience, But I I did. And at one point, I I thought it's funny. When I finally did, it was probably a year into podcasting. I went back to listen to it with the assumption of it was me worse than it actually was. I listened to him, like, you know, that wasn't great, but, like, it wasn't terrible. So, yeah, I've done that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:01:43

But, you know, like, now I'll regularly listen to myself, and it's still I don't think anyone ever gets fully comfortable with that, or maybe I just don't have enough reps yet. But I still do it not in a way to make myself a perfectionist. Right? I'm like, oh, so you gotta be better than that. No. I'm like, you know what? I could've delivered that more powerfully for listeners. So, yeah, I I make that a regular practice of what I do to go back and hear myself so I can get better for the people that are trusting me with their time.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:02:06

Yeah. I think that's a great point, Alex. I I think all of us. Right? I mean, I I remember way back when there were cassette tapes, and some of you listening don't know what that is. It's this thing that went in a thing called a tape player. And I remember me and my buddies, like, would record our voices on it, and it was like it seems like the worst thing is listening to your own voice because you always think you sound bad. And and I think even as you keep doing this, it's still like, I still feel like my voice could be better and you know but these Shure, MV sevens do a great job of trying to help us do that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:02:37

Yes. They do. I I will share this. The first time I ever got on a microphone was actually at my church, and they were doing, like, a sound check. And I was like, does my voice really sound like this? And I was like, yeah. Why? I'm like, I sound terrible. And everyone and the sound person goes, everyone says that. And I was like, cool.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:02:52

So my voice doesn't sound bad. Everyone just assumes that their voice sounds bad. So, I love that. And by the way, Amazon probably sells cassette tapes again. One of my buddies he's in a big band, and they sold out of cassettes. And their demographic is, like, 15, 16 year olds. So I'm like, wait a minute. I'm like, hold on now.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:03:08

Like, do they even know how to what that is? Like, put that on Amazon. We could probably find that.

Chris Stone [: 00:03:14

That's amazing. So, Alex, here's where I'd I'd love to start off with because I wanna get into the books because great job, by the way. One just really super well done with the book series. I I think the whole thing is very smart. It's not just about PodMatch and all about PodMatch. That is certainly, you know, and should be, you know, a a huge component of those, and it is. But there's just so many really, really super quality evergreen nuggets that are in. Is evergreen nuggets even a thing? I don't know.

Chris Stone [: 00:03:45

But there it really is is high quality. But one of the things that I find really interesting that I'd love to be able to have you speak to, because a lot of the people that listen and watch our show are entrepreneurs, and they have this this journey, and they may be at certain spots in the journey. And you are sitting here with, what is what I would consider, a successful software company that you've created and been a part of. And, you know, PodPros is is something that, you know, is is, you know, sort of the standard for a lot of people, and you've really fit and filled sort of a solved like a pain point for a lot of podcasters in what you've done. But you didn't wake up like this. You started and had a you had a journey that led you to that point that included the success, but also probably included some failures. I'd love for, for our listeners, our viewers to to sort of hear hear about that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:04:40

Yeah. Sure. Thanks for opening up the mic for me on on that. This I don't get to talk with this often, so it's always great to to do this, but this was go back years. I had a fifteen year career in in aerospace. And real quick, anyone who's watching or listening, you should know a few things. I was not a skydiver, was not a fighter pilot, and was not an astronaut. Just making that real clear here.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:04:59

We focus below the atmosphere, and we are parts manufacturer. Yeah. So you all assume I've been to the moon. I'm sorry. I'm not another one of your guests who had been to the moon. So how's that happening?

Chris Stone [: 00:05:07

Okay. Let's end the conversation right now, Alex. All credibility

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:05:10

is gone. Sorry, guys. But so what what like, what happened with that career, like, I loved it. And I worked behind a desk, and I really enjoyed it. I ran the commercial operations division. So I was a senior director at the company and worked my way to the executive level. I was controlling profit margins and processes, and that's that's what I did. And I thoroughly enjoyed that line of work.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:05:28

And, obviously, I worked my way up to that. Right? So it was a fifteen year career, but at year 12 or year thirteen, it all gets blurry over time. But at one of those years, somewhere between then, the company went public. We we we sold to a bigger company. We're a multibillion dollar organization. It went public. It was really fun to be part of that. However, I had this experience one day that changed it for me.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:05:49

And I I saved I helped the company save 10% margins in, like, a a cumulative of five r divisions. Like, so it was huge. I mean, it was, like, a big like, saving 10%, like, across the board. That was amazing. So, like, in my head, I did this, but I didn't really. I went I I was on the executive team. I went straight to my CEO's office. In my head, I kicked his door down on the way in.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:06:08

I didn't really do that. We're stuck. We opened up. Also, in my head, I put my feet on his desk when I was telling him this. I also didn't do that. But I sat there. I'm like, hey. Did you see, did you see what we did? And he goes, yeah.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:06:18

I saw it. And I was like, we, we we saved 10%. Like, we didn't we didn't go over by 10%. He's like, no. No. I know. I saw it. He goes, the shareholders are really not happy, though.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:06:27

Like, you didn't tell them that we were gonna do that. They could've been selling the stocks at a higher level if we would've told them that that wasn't happen. And and I I didn't get in trouble necessarily, but I remember walking out of that office, going down the hall back to my office, feeling a little bit defeated and realizing, you know what? I think I've always been a little bit of an entrepreneur even though I've been in this company and I can't do that anymore. And at that point in my career, thankfully, my my performance always stayed the same. And I will say, this is a side note, but my last year at that company was my best. I left on a good foot because I believe the way you end one season is the way you begin the next. Even a year later, they invited me back to come speak at somebody's going away party, which was really cool. So I left on good terms.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:07:03

I did the company right. But that year twelve, year thirteen mark, wherever that was, I made the decision walking out of my office that day that it was time to go. I did not know how to do that, and this is where podcasting comes into play. My my brilliant mind, or lack thereof, decided the best way to learn how to become an entrepreneur would be to talk to entrepreneurs. Didn't wanna pay people to do that. And I was like, you know what? I'll start a podcast. I will talk to people who have successfully left a nine to five job to pursue entrepreneurship full time. I'll bring them on.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:07:28

I will ask interesting questions and make it a way that people wanna hear it. Thankfully, that show actually did really well. It turns out I'm not the only person who wanted to leave a nine to five job. And, I just, like, listened and learned. And two things happened during that sprint of that podcast. I learned how to become an entrepreneur, and I realized that I wanted it to be in the podcasting space specifically. And that was, like, a really cool moment for me. So I started, like, my show did well, like I said.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:07:49

So I started speaking at podcasting conferences, getting great opportunities, and just falling more and more in love with the people that made up this industry. It's an abundance mindset industry. Aerospace is kinda cutthroat. Like, the person sitting next to you is your friend, but also don't cross them because they will steal your sale. That type of thing. Right? But, like, I just learned that, like, damn, this industry has so much room, so much abundance. We can serve together. And, ultimately, that's what led me to becoming a full time entrepreneur.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:08:13

It was it was both podcasting and just really learning to that craft and what it looked like.

Chris Stone [: 00:08:18

So you, in a way, you used your podcast to talk to entrepreneurs. It wasn't like I'm I'm starting this podcast to make money. I'm starting this podcast because it's maybe fun, although you probably made it fun and realized it was and that you developed that passion. You didn't even know at that point. You said, I wanna talk to entrepreneurs, and this is how I'm gonna do it.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:08:41

Yeah. I mean and and don't get me wrong. I tried a little monetization. Like, here's the thing. I don't want anyone to ever listen to me and think that I was, like, a a one hit wonder. Like, I just made it. Right? Like, no. I I had a bunch of failed attempts, and it was a couple years.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:08:53

So there there's a gap there. Right? I started a podcast and learned this between year twelve and thirteen, but I was there for fifteen years. So keep that in mind. There was some time there where I was, like, trying things, failing, trying, failing. But I think that that's really part of entrepreneurship. Anyone who says, yeah. I hit it right the first time, might have just gotten lucky. Right? Like, part of being a good entrepreneur is trying things and not and then not working, but getting right back up and trying again.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:09:12

And so, yeah, I tried things on the way, but the podcast was, again, that connection vehicle and that learning hub for me. Like, I I made it a point to read a host book if I was gonna interview them. And that gave me pressure of, like, I'm interviewing them four days. I gotta read this whole book. Right? And I can learn and grow from that. And that's it it was my primary learning vehicle at the time.

Chris Stone [: 00:09:31

How did you turn the page there from from these failures? You're talking about multiple failures through here. What kept you driven through all of that? Yeah.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:09:41

I don't know what necessarily kept me driven other than the fact that I knew I wanted to to be I wanted to create something. I wanted to be that entrepreneur, and I I can't even really explain it. Like, I just I believe we're all created beings, and as created beings, we all have some desire to create, whether that's in an organization, whether that's just some hobby for fun. But for me, I if I go back to my childhood, and this is not to put myself down at all, like, I'm not naturally good at a lot of things. Like, I wasn't a good athlete as a kid. I wasn't even good at video games. And, like, you hope to get one or the other. Right? But I wasn't a I wasn't a smart student.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:10:12

All my brothers are musicians. I can't clap on beat. Like, it's like, what happened? But the one thing I was good at from a kid was I understood business for some reason. And so when I thought about, like, being creative the way that I can, I just knew that it was to creatively serve the world with some sort of business venture? And what I ultimately learned like, if I can summarize entrepreneurship real quick, it was I learned to find an area of passion, to get into the community, to find out what that community was struggling with, and to create a solution for that problem they had. Like, those four steps, like, I'm not saying, like, I don't mean to to simplify it to that level. I talked to hundreds of people. Right? They're, like, gifted in their craft. But at the end of day, like, that's what it boiled down to.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:10:51

And the turning point for me was stopping the art of trusting my own my own idea, which is what so many of us creative people do. Right? Like, we have an idea. We wanna try it. I stopped having ideas, and I started looking for problems with people that I cared about, which, again, were podcasters. So when I started identifying their problems, I was able to build a solution for something that existed, not an idea. I got an idea based off of a problem and offered that solution.

Chris Stone [: 00:11:15

Wow. Yeah. And, you know, it's it's it's very similar, you know, conceptually to when we talked to Mark Savant, a few weeks ago as well. It's like once you figure out that people have problems and that you have the cure, and you have the medicine for that, that's when things start rolling. And so let's talk about rolling into PodMatch because I I from what I understand, and and correct me if I'm wrong, and I'll I'll I'll let you sort of elaborate on this. This was was this sort of the origin of this happened during or maybe around the time of the last in person event of 2020 before this pandemic, which was Podfest, and, just talking to pod podcasters and realizing there was a pain point. Is that an accurate statement?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:12:06

Yeah. It is. And and real quick to jump back to something, you mentioned Mark Savant. That episode, I I listened to I'm team replay, by the way, so go team replay. Like, audio. Alright. I love that. I was in the gym today.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:12:15

I listened to the episode from it was eleven nine as we all released it. It was about achieving 6 figure, 6 figures through podcasting, more or less, with Marc Savant. I highly recommend that if you're enjoying this, go back and listen to that because that is an epic episode that you all did. So quick shout there. But but, yes, you're absolutely right. So, again, I was, had a show that gave me a platform. So I was speaking at these events. And that one, specifically, there's about 2,000 people at this Podfest Orlando.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:12:39

And, literally, that was, like, the week the world shut down. Like, you know, Florida. Florida is the first or the last to shut down, the first to open up. That's kinda how we roll. Side note there. But, anyway, while I was there, I made a point. I told my wife, when I get off stage, I'm gonna ask these people what they're struggling with. I'm just gonna ask Anyone who will talk to me.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:12:57

And here's the thing, like, if you speak on stage, people are nice. If you're a good or bad speaker, it doesn't matter. People are gonna line up to say thank you for being there. Right? And so every single one that would give me that time, I just had, like, a little notepad. And I was just well, it wasn't gonna pay my phone. I'm, like, like, drawing it like I was actually writing it. But I was on my phone. Right? And just checking a box every time somebody said something.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:13:14

I heard a lot of things, but 100 people. I ended it 100 people that said the same thing. Alex, I'm having trouble finding the ideal guest for my show. Mhmm. And the weird thing is the rest of that conference that was in my head, and I started meeting people that, like, oh, I don't have a podcast. I have this book. Do you know any podcast I could be on? And I was like, man, there might be something here. And I went home and, again, I found the problem.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:13:35

And I was like, I think I can do something with this. Strangely enough, it took me about a week before it, like, really hit. But I whiteboarded out, and I was like, you know what? Like, an industry that does this well is the industry of dating apps. It connects people that might be interested in each other together. I'm like, what if we could connect a guest and a host based off of their expertise and what they're interested in having on their show? And for lack of a better term, that's what we built. We built what's like a podcast or or sorry, like a dating app for podcasters. And, the funny thing is I've never used a dating app because I've been married, too long for that. They weren't around yet.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:14:05

And we actually took it a step further, which I didn't realize. Dating apps apparently don't help you schedule the date. They kinda leave that on you. We actually help you schedule the interview, so you never have to exchange an email. I'm like, man, maybe dating apps should take a note from us, but I digress.

Chris Stone [: 00:14:17

Right. Yeah. Note to, all of the dating apps, Christian Mingle and

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:14:24

I mean, I don't even know

Chris Stone [: 00:14:25

I don't even know what the dating apps are either. I've I've been married for for years. But I I love the fact that you identified a problem. Like, you didn't even like, there wasn't even a a concept in your mind, like, this is what I'm going to do. I I wonder if these people can help me prove, what this concept is. You just over and over and over, and by the time you hit 100, you're like, this is it. This is the pain point I gotta go after, and I have to figure out how to solve it.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:14:51

Yeah. You know, one thing I'll add to that is entrepreneurs, myself included, we over complicate problems by a long shot. Mhmm. And I I learned this from actually the one of the guys at Podfest, Chris Karmitzos. He has a book called Start Ugly. And it just means, basically, like, start start before you're ready. That book is also on Amazon, by the way. And if there's one book you buy, I would love for you to buy mine, but go buy that one first.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:15:09

I'm just gonna say that. Start Ugly, Chris Karmitzos. It's on Amazon. That's the only place you can get it, actually, I think. But go grab that. And and here's why, like, I need to remember, okay. This is the problem I'm solving. I didn't need to say, okay.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:15:21

Well, I need to help them launch a podcast, or I need to help them become expert guests first. Right? You know what? At the end of the day, when we launched, the idea came like, when I finally whiteboard it out and and wrote up paperwork with my partner, the the developer side of things, all that was March 15. And on or sorry. 03/10/2020. And on 06/15/2020, we launched an early beta. We didn't have a logo or anything. And we just you wanna who I I marketed to? I told a hundred people that said they're having a problem. They gave me their contact information.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:15:47

I said, does this solve the problem? And some were like, well, it doesn't really, like it doesn't have a logo, and it's kinda slow. I'm like, does it solve the problem? Yeah. It does. I'm like, perfect. Now we can focus on continuous improvement. Let's make it better. But before we added more features, we wanna make sure that it actually was a pain point that was worth solving. Because some entrepreneurs, they'll go, like, way big, and the problem is when they go back and be like, here, I solved your problem.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:16:07

Some people might be like, oh, well, I just like to complain. I don't really wanna do anything about it. Right? Like and so don't spend too much time and money on it before you really validate the fact again, like, making sure, is this really going to solve the pain point? Am I doing it at the smallest level?

Jim Fuhs [: 00:16:22

Yeah. I love this too because this is something that Chris is, he knows I'm really excited about this term, and and I don't know if Chris invented it, but I always give him credit. What we're doing right now, right, we're live solving people's problems. We're not selling. We're solving. And I think that what you've done is, right, you you've helped people solve this problem of how do we, you know, how do we find those good guests? Or, you know, if we're a guest, how do I find those good shows that want to share in my message that you know? Because, ultimately, it should be a win win situation. It shouldn't be one wins and one, you know, is is kind of the the slave to it. So I I love how in these two books, we kinda see both perspectives.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:17:02

Right? And, Chris, you you bring this up a lot too is sometimes when people come to you as a as a podcast, consultant, and and, Alex, you may run the same thing, is, like, people say, well, I wanna have a show. But the truth is that people don't always need a show because what they really wanna do is talk about their, you know, their expertise, the thing that they wanna help people solve. And so sometimes they're better off actually staying as a guest and not getting into the hosting side of things.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:17:34

I I I completely agree with this. As a matter of fact, I I just spoke last weekend at a conference, and one of the first things I said, because someone they were I was talking about starting a podcast. That's what the topic they had me do. The very first thing I said is, maybe you shouldn't start a podcast. And I just paused. People were, like, looking around, like, what the heck? Is he trying not to speak? You know, like, what's this guy here for? And I said, what you should do is oh, okay. First off, invest a little bit. Like, you know, if you're just gonna be a guest, buy this m Shure m v seven.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:17:59

Right? Buy some good earbuds to put in. Buy, like, a nice I use a Logitech four k camera. Like, you guys have nicer gear than I do. But, like, my stuff is USB. I plug it in to a laptop, and I'm done. Right? Like and I love that. But I tell people, like, go be a guest first. Invest in this gear.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:18:15

And here's the here's the secret about this gear. In 2020, you could've sold it for more than you bought it for. But now you can sell it for what you buy it for. So if you decide you hate it, you throw it on, like, Facebook Marketplace or something like that. Like, it'll be gone like that for what you paid for. That's just how this industry is. So fun hack there for you. But invest in it and go on a few shows.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:18:31

Before you start one, go on a few. What I've had people do is they've been like, okay, Alex. I'll give it a shot. They email me, like, I freaking hate podcasting. Like, thank god. I didn't waste six months trying to come up with my own show. Like, this is the worst ever. And And I have other people be like, this is so good.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:18:44

I don't actually need a show because I'm, like, scratching the itch of talking the way I want to. I don't need the show. And then there's also that third category. Right? People are like, this is amazing. I'm starting a show. These people are already gonna come on my show because now I have some built in guests that are ready to go. Like, the I think starting with being a podcast guest is the way to go when it comes to podcasting.

Chris Stone [: 00:19:03

Yeah. And you touch on this, you know, there's a thing, called pod fade, and I'm sure you're familiar with it. Alex and and Jim, I've probably hundred times in front of you, so you obviously know what it is. But, you know, some of our viewers and listeners and some of our new viewers, which, by the way, if you're watching on any of the other places and we're seeing all of these comments and putting them on the screen, thank you for joining us. If you wanna join us over on Amazon where we have these two new books from Alex Sanfilippo, which is PodMatch Guest Mastery and Host Mastery, all of this stuff, we're just scratching the surface on what is included in these, in these books. But I you know, something that you touched on that, I really wanted to just kinda peel back. I think a lot you you talked about, you know, just don't start a podcast and the whole pod fade thing. Right? And I think a lot of it happens with they don't realize.

Chris Stone [: 00:20:00

They just they they didn't know why they were doing it in the first place. They didn't know what the purpose of doing a podcast, what they really wanted to do. But even if they did and they got six or eight episodes in and they didn't like it, and I've had clients that you know, I used to be Alex, I used to be like, come on. You gotta put in the reps. You gotta keep on you know, you gotta you know, like, the coach in the gym. Right? Come on. Let's you know, five more, five, four, three. You know? And and by the time they got to episode 20, you could just tell they hated it.

Chris Stone [: 00:20:28

Their voice changed. Their everything about it changed. And now I've just changed my whole thing on this, and that is if you don't like doing it, find something else. If you need a podcast, find someone else to do it, because podcasting is absolutely can be beneficial to you. It can fill a bunch of ROIs for you depending on what that is, if it's financial, if it's getting more speaking engagements, if it's getting whatever that is. But, man, if you don't like doing it, it's really important to be able to have someone that can identify that and get you maybe out of that seat. Would you agree with that?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:21:06

Yeah. You know, I've I've never given it much thought because I think that, Chris, I think I go with your your old thought process, which is just you gotta grind it out. You gotta go. Okay. Get you know, the 20 getting 20 episodes is, like, once you're there, you can make it pretty far. The next drop off is at, like, 50, I think, or something like that for people to get to. And that's, like, kinda where the the stats go. And, like, there's it's a high failure rate.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:21:26

But I have always leaned more towards the keep on going, but I love what you're saying here, which is, like, if you really hate it, just stop. Right? If if you hate it because it's a lot of work and you you know, there's there's obviously you gotta get kinda get into the the real reason behind it. If someone just straight up doesn't like it, then, yeah, then then don't do it. There's other forms of creation. Right? Like, you can you can create online and be that creator and and many other ways. You can dance on TikTok for for, you know, whatever whatever you wanna do. But, no, I I I think that's a really interesting thought that I have not thought about. Oh, yeah.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:21:54

And, Jim, by the way, you're you have, like, a TikTok channel devoted to your dances. Right? Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:21:59

Do the do the gym. Everybody.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:22:02

I like that. I can do that. This is, this

Chris Stone [: 00:22:07

is an incredible conversation. I'm I apologize we're jumping all over the place, but, I I wanted to touch on this. We're gonna we're gonna get into PodMatch because I am a PodMatch user, full disclosure. I'm I'm in the agency, program, and I have a number of clients there. We actually used PodMatch to have the guests that you see here on your screen because we knew that was the way we can get Alex Sanfilippo on our show.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:22:30

Nice job.

Chris Stone [: 00:22:31

So, Alex, what makes a good podcast guest?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:22:36

I think there's a there's a handful of things here, but the the very first one is somebody who really knows why they're showing up and can articulate that before they even get booked. And sometimes, and I don't mean to be rude, but sometimes I find that that coaches, more like general life coaches, stuff like that, they don't quite understand the reason that they're going on a show. And so they'll share share stories. Like, they'll talk about their dog. They'll talk about surfing. They'll talk about this and that. And it kinda goes all over the place. And I'm not trying to be rude, but then you get those coaches that are, like, honed in.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:23:03

Like, I'm a coach. It only helps this person. They got it dialed in. And then they'll share, like, on that one track the whole way, but in a way that adds value. And I'm I'm picking on coaches. That goes for anything. Right? But for that reason of, like, having that focus is why I've always liked authors. Because if they have a book and I say, hey.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:23:18

We're talking about this book, they seem to stay on track pretty well because they, hopefully, know their book pretty well. And so, for me, the very first thing is just for for to be a good guest is to know why you're going there, to be able to articulate that. So that when somebody says, hey. Will you come on and talk about you live in Jackson Floor. Talk about surfing. You can say, no. I I don't really talk about that. I talk about building a a business that you can enjoy.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:23:39

Right? Like, you can you can say that. And if you can tie it in, great. Because it's a surfing business. Why not? But, my point is, like, they know their direction is the first thing. The next thing is one that I'm really working on is the ability to answer bad questions really well. And the reason I say I'm working on this is because the one number one question every podcast guest get gets asked is tell the listeners about yourself. You all didn't ask that, by the way. Like I said, Jim and Chris, you all are pros, but that is the number one question I've been asked.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:24:04

Tell the listeners about yourself. You get the wrong like, if you're a host and you get the wrong guest on, they're gonna go for twenty minutes on that. And it's not gonna be about anything that you wanna talk to them about because they're gonna talk about what they ate last week, what their favorite color is. Right? Like, everything. And so it's to answer those questions. Like, a good guest can answer in a way that they say, how can I answer this in real time in a way that will direct the conversation back to where we want it to go? Versus just, well, I was born and raised in Jacksonville, Florida. I I live here, but I don't surf because I can't stand up on a surfboard. And, like, these things don't get shared.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:24:34

Right? But the thing is they have that direction. So, again, they know what they share. They can answer those bad questions in a really good way. And the next thing is they can always return it back to the host. Like, they have to remember that, like, the audience is here. They they might show up because of the guest, but they stay because of the host. And they have to make sure they can find a way to direct it back to them, not to make themselves look amazing. Like, oh, yeah.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:24:54

Jim Jim and Chris are alright, but let me tell you what I did on Amazon. You know? Like, there's none of that. It goes back to the fact that, hey. You're here with with deal casters. These are the best of the best. They can find a way to tastefully direct that back. There's a lot more things, but those are some of the main things I find that keep listeners engaged with a guest because, again, a listener is staying because they like the host. And when a guest is talking good about the host, that reinforces why the listener is there in my mind.

Chris Stone [: 00:25:18

Well, you're doing it right now with us. I mean, it's like it it it almost you know, you're you're actually like, even before you answered the question the way you did, you were serving us in this conversation. Right? And and as, us being podcast host, who's bigger on your screen right now? It's not Jim Fuze because he would make both of us invisible, by the way, Alex. Right? But but it's it's you. You are the star of our show. Like, if if, these these knuckleheads that are on the right hand side side of your screen showed up every week and we were big every time, it would get a little it would get a little boring. So you've chosen to come to our house. You are our guest.

Chris Stone [: 00:25:58

Right? You are someone so when you have someone that's coming into your home and you know that they're coming, what do you do? You clean the house a little bit, maybe. You know? You you maybe, you know, pull out those those Entenmann's, coffee, you know, coffee cakes, you know, that you were you know, that you got. Not the day old ones. Like, the really the ones that just came out. You know? Like, the you know, you've got somebody coming out, you know, like the orange juice and cookies backstage.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:26:21

I I you know? But Delicious, by the way. Thank you.

Chris Stone [: 00:26:24

Yeah. Of course. Of course. It's cinnamon. That's the secret ingredient that, Jim's wife, puts in that. So speaking of, being a bet a good guest, podcast guest mastery as well as podcast host mastery are available here on Amazon. And if you're not, familiar how to get right here and continue to watch the show, pick up the books, and that buttery smooth, m sure m v seven, come on over to dealcasters.live, or you can come here and go to podmatch.dealcasters.live. But I'm gonna read a little bit or just, not not read it verbatim.

Chris Stone [: 00:26:56

But something that caught that I dog eared on pod match guest mastery here, Alex, was something from our, mutual friend, Mike Capuzzi, who, obviously was a key component of these books

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:27:09

Thanks, Mike.

Chris Stone [: 00:27:09

As as well. Yeah. He's he's amazing. And I really love the concept when you're a podcast guest is, you know, what seems to happen, sort of the typical run of show, 95% of podcasts do this. Right? There's intro music, there's a, hi, I do this, and and then here's who your guest is, then the show, and then at the end, how can people find you?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:27:35

Right? Another question that's not that great, by the way. Right?

Chris Stone [: 00:27:38

Right. How can people find you? Right? It just is like, of course, you know how to find this person. Like, how do you and and by the way, who's and what that tells your audience is, okay. Show's over. Right? Show's done. They're winding down. Forget it. You know, whatever.

Chris Stone [: 00:27:56

Instead, start weaving that in, but I really love the concept. And the value one of the other values of this book is the concept of of offering a gift to the host, to the listeners and the viewers of the of that particular podcast, offering a gift to them on the front end, no one says no to that. If Alex, if you came on and said, Chris, Jim, I've got a gift for your viewers, for your listeners. I want them to have this. I don't whatever it is. And who's gonna say no to that? Well, that's going to be touched on during the course of the conversation, and in the book, it's got all of these people's gifts as as examples that that you can use on your show. I thought that was a just a brilliant, brilliant concept that that Mike brought up, and that's just one of, like, 30 different people on these two books that are giving you value for these things. So, I mean, what how did you come up with that concept of of of putting together these gifts for, for this book? And maybe, if you could, maybe speak a little bit more about Mike's approach.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:29:02

Yeah. So first off, everyone should know, like, I picked up these books. So it was community driven. Actually, they weren't my idea at all. As a matter of fact, members of our community approached saying, hey. We'd like to write a book about how we podcast guests, and they're like, we talked to some people who are podcast hosts, and they wanna write the same thing. And I was like, okay. I'm like, I don't know anything about books.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:29:24

Like, I know how to read them. That's about all I know. And, and they're like, well, there's a guy on PodMatch named Mike Capuzzi who knows this stuff. Can we introduce you? So I got introduced, and he's like, hey. Here's how I would approach it. And, like, literally, I think I I spent six hours total working on these two books. That's all I did. And I'm very thankful for that because it was community driven, which is everything we do at Pod Pros.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:29:45

Like, everything we do is by the community, for the community. So it just furthers that that mission and vision. The one thing I told Mike, I'm like, this has to add value. Actually, two things. Sorry. This has to add value. We have to find a way to to make this worthwhile to anyone who picks it up. That's the first thing.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:29:59

And number two, I said I never want to make a single penny off of this. I'm like, anything that comes to me, I am donating. I'm gonna pick the cause right now. And so we we worked all that stuff out. I'm like and those were the two the only two rules I put on it. And the thing is I have these books all kinds of marked up. I'm, like, reading through them. Like, dang.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:30:16

That's a good idea. Like and, like, so I'm, like, going through it. And one side note here, I gave my cofounder, Jesse Hunter, I gave him a copy of each book, and he started opening up and being like, you know what? We could change the software so we could do this. I I immediately was like, give me these books. You're not allowed to read these books. Like, we gotta stay focused. Right? But at the end of the day, again, this is people that we consider to be the we call it, you know, PodMatch guest and host master because these are people that have they've done very well as podcasters, but they've also done exceptionally well on PodMatch specifically. And they are just sharing the best tips for both sides of those things, like how to use that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:30:47

And the the the thing is they've added so much value that people buy the host book. They've, like, emailed them and be like, I'm only a host, but I bought the guest book too so I could learn what it's like to be a good guest. Brilliant. It's just been so much, like, so much value add including to me as a person who's read through it. Right? Like, I'm like, man, this is really good stuff. But at the end of the day, again, like, I had to lead from value, and it had to really serve our community and be by and for our community. That was what was really important to me.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:31:13

Yeah. And and I wanna tell you too something, Alex. As someone that's been livestreaming for over four years as a live stream host, and and this is something we we kind of talked about before the show, this these books, even as a live streamer, gave me some ideas of how I can do a better live stream show, and so part of my question to you is, do you think PodMatch is possibly a place too where maybe livestream host wanna consider either host or or even the guest? Because I did notice that some of the people in the book are doing, they may not always be live, but they are doing a video podcast. And that is something that is growing. There's a big push. Right? YouTube now has podcast. And and even this show right now, we're live streaming this, but we're also going to turn this into an audio podcast. Have you thought about expanding that reach to the the live stream community? Because I don't think there's a, you know, anything like this that I've seen outside of what you've created with PodMatch.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:32:13

Yeah. It's look. First off, by the way, team replay. That's me. Once again, I listen to this show while I'm in the gym. That's when I listen. It it's got the right energy, so it's not like making me tired while I'm working out. Because some podcast, you know, it's like it's like, man, I don't wanna work out anymore.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:32:27

I'm gonna sit here. Right? You guys have never made me tired, by the way, that you all do this episode. So great this this show. So great job. But I think that, like, as a live streamer, like, you might as well repurpose it unless it's straight up a visual thing. Like, I'll I'll do this, and for all the audio listeners, I'm showing off a water bottle. But if you're like, check this out. Do you guys see what this says on here? And, like, look at the shape of this right here.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:32:49

It's got this here. What I just did just sync like, anyone who was listening on audio note has no idea what just happened. And, again, I was just showing off a water bottle that's not that fancy. It's probably on Amazon, though. But, anyway, the, the point is, like, if you are not doing something like that specifically, you can easily repurpose it to audio. And, like, I always say audio first. Like, my mind is like, hey. Produce whatever you're doing for audio first.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:33:12

Now if you're livestream, that is totally different. But your guys' show, I've never listened to the audio version of it because that's how I listen and felt left out. Like, I've never had that happen, been like, oh, man. I wish I knew what they were talking about. Like, that just hasn't happened. And so you all do a good job with that. I think that for anyone who's livestreaming, who can find a way to say, you know what? Can I have audio in mind? The best way I've actually found to do this, and this maybe takes it really extreme, pretend like you have people that want to consume your content that are blind. Mhmm.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:33:40

If you think about it that way and keep those people in mind, because you may

Chris Stone [: 00:33:43

actually have

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:33:44

some of those people. If you can keep them in mind, you can do a good job converting whatever you have to a podcast. And I know some people that are really like, they will describe a water bottle that I'm holding again. Well, they will do it in such a way that when you listen to an audio, you feel like you can see it. And and so for me, I tell people, like, hey. Just repurpose that. Like, I I'm not affiliated, but I use I use Buzzsprout. They're also in Jacksonville, Florida.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:34:04

It makes it real easy. I literally schedule out something to go, and it goes to everybody, Apple, Spotify, Amazon, Google, and thousands of other places at the push of a button. There's no, like, ongoing work for it. So when it moves livestream, it's like, oh, but I don't wanna take the time to put on those places. You don't have to. The these these syndication companies, they do it on your behalf. And so yeah. Like, I know I'm answering this question a long way, but I'm passionate about repurposing the content.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:34:26

There might be a lot of people who would love to consume your livestream, but they wanna do it on Team Replay. Right? Like me. I'm one of those people for the majority. And and, yeah, I think that you can use a service like like PodMatch very easily to say, you know what? I'm gonna start sourcing some guests. That is something that you can do. And it it's, again, it's just gonna make the whole process easier for you, I believe.

Chris Stone [: 00:34:47

Yeah. You're speaking, you're speaking my love language, which is repurposing, right now, and this is exactly how I use it, Alex. I have, a number of clients, including one that is in here in the chat, PeePrimo. Shout out to Pete Primo and the Pete Primo show. And we use this for guests on his show and other shows, the Big Ticket Life, Dealcasters, and others. And, what you're seeing right now gets repurposed into an audio podcast, and I think a lot of people kinda run into that. Well, how do I do it because my show runs this way or it normally runs that way? It's fairly simple, and I know you've had speakers on Podcasting Made Simple and, at the events that you've had for for pod pros that talk about doing a run of show. And if it is a live show, how you could take a segment and not have to edit for hours to be able to repurpose that into a podcast.

Chris Stone [: 00:35:40

And I thought, you know, I should also make, mention, in addition to these books, in the carousel as well is the podcast, Podcasting Made Simple, hosted by Alex Sanfilippo, which has I I really love the podcast, Alex, because in a way, it has there there's consistency in terms of the topic, right, in in in podcasting, but there's variance within that. So you can get really, you know, in in-depth about certain elements of podcast, but it's also like there'll be one episode, and it would be you solo, or it might be somebody else that you've recorded from a particular, broadcast that you've hosted, or it may be an interview. There's there's different things that are going on there, but there's always a consistent episode that is consistent on the theme. Is that is that intentional on your part? Do you do any livestream repurposing?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:36:35

Yep. So I don't do any livestreaming at all. I'm I'm scared to death of what you all do, but I respect the heck out of it. But I am gonna have you all come speak at one of my quarterly events about it so I can gain some confidence. Like, when I had the entrepreneurship podcast, learn to become an entrepreneur, I do that with podcasting now. So you all can kinda follow my trend. Like, I I bring on people that are interesting that I can learn from so I can do this. At some point, who knows? Maybe I'll be the next, I don't know, deal casters or something like that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:36:59

Who knows? Oh. But, yeah, the the the point is there, like, I don't do it now, but that's the type of thing I like to bring on the show. Because anything in my mind that helps a guest or host go further faster, that's what we bring on Podcasting Made Simple. The idea is either side of the mic. How can we support it? And what we do is every other week, it's either for a guest or host. The thing is a lot of our hosts, they just listen to all the episodes. And same with all the guests. They're like, oh, well, this will teach me what a good host looks like, so I'm gonna listen to what they say about it.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:37:24

We try to keep them fairly short for the most part. The interview is a little bit longer. But other than that, we try to keep it really short and straight to the point. Again, it's just helping them go further faster, and that's the idea behind it.

Chris Stone [: 00:37:34

Awesome. Amazing. So let me, let me work into my next question. What makes a good podcast host?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:37:41

A lot of things. The the first thing that we just kinda talked about there is is having some sort of specific niche, some sort of focus, I think, is the first thing. If it's a general podcast these days, I find that just doesn't really do as well. Like, at one point, when there wasn't a lot of shows, like, you could do that. And if you're super famous, you can start a show about whatever you want or probably do well. But if you're like me, you gotta actually have some sort of focus. You can't be everything to everybody. And the way I always say it is when someone tells me, well, Alex, my show is kinda for everybody.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:38:12

I always say that it's for nobody then. They're like, well, no. It's for everybody. I'm like, well, nobody's everybody. So it doesn't work like that. Right? Like, it it just can't. And I think it's important to keep that in mind is that we have to have some sort of focus with the content. So step one for me is make sure that you know that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:38:27

The next thing is once you have that focus, who's the avatar in that space? So, like, who is it that you actually speak to? And I like to get really specific like this. So, like, my avatar or ideal listener is not a way to say it. He has a name. His name's Adam. And I know everything about Adam. His age, where he lives, when he listens, which happens to be the gym. He's kinda similar to me. Right? Like, he's in his he's a podcaster, but he's also thinking about being a guest now because he wants to grow his show faster.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:38:50

Right? Like, I've got all these specific things. So I've got the focus. I've got the avatar. And then I just make sure that will all of my content serve that person. All of my content serve that person. And so, I run it by everything. When someone pitches me an idea of, like, hey, Alex, I wanna talk about this on Podcasting Made Simple, my first question is, will this add value to Adam's journey? And if the answer is no or even, maybe, then it's a no. At the end of the day, as a podcast host, our number one goal is to protect our listeners from whoever comes on our show.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:39:20

Like, you are the wall that's going to to help them. And the reason that people stay around your podcast is because they feel like they can trust you. But here's the thing, if next week, I keep on using I live really close to the ocean, so I keep on using surfing as an example. I don't surf. Let me give that disclaimer. But if I bring on a guest to talk about building surfboards, I just broke trust for my listeners. This is podcasting made simple. This is not surfing made simple.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:39:42

Good show idea, though, by the way. Side note. But the thing is, if I break that trust, now they're like, I wonder if the next episode will be good. And they'll tell like, if someone's like, oh, you listen to that show? And be like, yeah. But they have some weird stuff on there. Right? Like, that's how the conversation's gonna go. So keeping this simple and kinda kinda short for you guys here. Again, make sure that you have a niche, a focus for the show that's very narrow.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:40:02

Number two, make sure you know who the ideal listener is and really speak to them, and make sure you don't bring on wrong guests, wrong content. Share what they're actually looking for to help them go further faster. As I said, that should always be the goal.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:40:14

Yeah. So important. I I think and I think too, one of the things I got out of the books as well is it's okay to say no. Right? Yes. Don't think just because, oh, all these people

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:40:23

want me to be

Jim Fuhs [: 00:40:24

on their show or all these people wanna be on my show that you need to accept them. You really need to do your homework. And one of the things that that Chris and I both do, whether it's for this show or other shows we work with is, you know, people are looking at, in a sense, your portfolio. Has this person been on camera before? What do they sound like? You you know, that gets talked about by several of of your, contributors to the books is, like, you need to know this upfront because if the person doesn't have the energy, the show is gonna be horrible, and you're you know? Then the question is, do you even, you know, put it out there? I mean, you just, you know, gave away a part of your life you're not gonna get back, and so, it's just like in business, right? We're not we shouldn't say yes to everybody that says they want to work with it. It's the same thing whether you're a guest or whether you're a host. You know, you you deserve to, you know, reach out. You know, if anything, you're gonna reach out to those five people that are better than you, that are gonna make you better, I think.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:41:21

Jim, what you just shared is so insightful, and can I add something to that real quick?

Chris Stone [: 00:41:25

Yeah. Absolutely.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:41:26

I'm I'm a people pleaser. Just gonna level with you guys. Like, I I'm a people pleaser. And at first, when people started asking me to be on my show, at first, I was honored. Right? And then it was like, woah. There's a lot of people now who wanna be on my show. I'm, like, I'm so thankful for that. But I really struggled with, like, how do I say no when I know it's the wrong fit? And if I can be honest with you guys, and we're live, so honest with the world, the there was a few people early on when they started asking me on the show that I said yes to that I knew I should've said no to, but I couldn't bring myself to do it.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:41:53

So for anyone who's listening or watching and you're like me, you're that people pleaser, I found a really simple way to let somebody down in a graceful way. So what I say I still do it today because I I'm a people pleaser. So I say, hey, thank you so so much for reaching out. I really appreciate it. This show is really focused on helping a podcast guest or host go further faster, and I can tell that that's just not your expertise. Although, you have a lot of expertise in another field, I think it's in your and my best interest not to to waste each other's time. And I really respect yours. So for that reason, I'm gonna have to pass.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:42:23

I share almost like that word for word. And I've had one person one time get mad at that. Everyone else has been like, wow. I real like, literally, they're like, wow. I really respect the way that you responded to me. And so, like, it's it's helped me feel like I'm not necessarily like, no. Get lost. Right? Like, which Mhmm.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:42:37

That that that's uncomfortable for me to do. So now being, like, you know what? I'm coming from a place of service, not just for myself, my audience, but also to them. I don't wanna waste your time. It's too valuable for me to steal it like that. And positioning always helped me do get really good at saying no, and I I say no 90% of the time now.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:42:54

Alex, let me take that a step further because I think too because because, like, I I think all three of us are a little bit guilty that that people pleasing, maybe not Chris as much. But, do you ever sometimes, though, think like, you know, hey. I don't think you'd be a good fit for my show, but let me introduce you to, you know, Joe or Susie, who I think you guys might be the right fit. Because I think sometimes, you know, we can help others by guiding them towards somebody that is, you know, where it'll help both parties. Do you think that's also something that you can do? I mean, you may not be able Yes. To do it all the time, but what what do you think of that?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:43:28

That that's a good I I love that you brought I love where this conversation is going. This is so good. I know we're probably close to the end, but I I love that we got to talk about this. A %, yes. It doesn't happen all the time, but sometimes if I can see where that's going, not only do I make the recommendation and sometimes it'll even do an introduction, but I also explain why, which I hope helps them become a better host as well to realize, like, oh or sorry, better guest. Like, right? Like, they they realize, like, oh, I shouldn't go on all the shows. I should stay a little bit more focused. I've done that a handful of times when I only when I actually know somebody.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:43:56

Right? I'm not like, oh, yeah. Talk to my buddy, Chris. He, like, he'll he'd love to have you on the show. You know? Like, I don't just do that, like, have that fallback person because I believe you can fall into that. But, yes, if you can continue to add value and take it a step further, that's amazing. I think that's a great thing to do.

Chris Stone [: 00:44:12

So back to the host thing, there's in I I referred to Mike Capuzzi in in the in the pod podcast guest mastery. Now we're talking about, podcast host mastery. And by the way, if you are watching and there's a ton of people here on Facebook, YouTube, LinkedIn. Thank you for, thank you for joining us. We have a lot of new, viewers who are chiming in. You've got a lot of fan you brought your fan club,

Jim Fuhs [: 00:44:34

with you.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:44:34

I call them Alex. They're community members. I I don't I I just have community that I'm part of. That's it. I love it. Thanks for being

Chris Stone [: 00:44:40

here, Alex. It. We'd love if you, came over and, to Amazon, where these books are available as as well as, a lot of the stuff that Alex uses, day to day in his entrepreneurial journey, including those earbuds and his lighting and, as well as these two great books here. Just go to podmatch.dealcasters.live. It'll bring you right here to this show on Amazon. And thank you, Robin and, Woo Jin, who, who also followed us, and Marian Abrams, who, we are huge fans of, Grounded Pod, Grounded Content podcast as well as following. So if you do come over to Amazon, please smash that, follow button. And every time I don't know if you knew this, Alex.

Chris Stone [: 00:45:25

Every time someone follows Dealcasters on Amazon, a Blue Yeti gets its wings. Really?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:45:31

No. That's I didn't know that. That's amazing. Yes. And you mean it flies away so they can replace it with this. Right? Is that right?

Chris Stone [: 00:45:35

They're gonna use the MB7, and we're replacing.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:45:38

So that's what you meant by that. So Right. Right.

Chris Stone [: 00:45:40

It's up to them to put it in the put it in their their their Their their cart. Yeah. Their cart.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:45:44

Yes. That's the word. You would

Chris Stone [: 00:45:46

think I would know that by now being on on Amazon. So, this book, podcast host mastery, another person here that I thought had a really interesting thing, is, Wayne Gault, who's the three day weekend, entrepreneur. I thought it used to be the four day work week. Is is he changed that now,

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:46:06

the three day? I'm not gonna tell you his whole story. He did change it at the recommendation of, like, I think, one of his kids. He's like, three day weekend sounds better. And he was like, shoot. It does. And it really does. And it really does. And I think his audience, like, took off.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:46:17

It's just simple wording. Right? It's great. Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:46:20

Yeah. He was asked what beginner's mistake, was made, and and it's sort of to your point. He just took, a lot of a lot of people on because he was he was just, like, he was happy with some quantity. And what I thought was interesting is that and I've noticed this on PodMatch too. There is some very competent peep on you know? And you, which I would love to get into here too, maybe a two parter question here. You've gone to great lengths to make sure that this just isn't like anyone can come in and pay you however much money to be a part of this and just kind of, like, do the scattershot, approach of I wanna get on as many shows as possible or have as many people on as possible. You look at it from a from a quality perspective and say, who is who's really utilizing the platform in the right way? And you just kind of clean house a little bit, but I thought one of the things that Wayne spoke about was, you know, there's some really competent, high level, very, you know, there's some people I'm I'm very, quite frankly, you know, a little intimidated about approaching. Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:47:29

And and so I see that. I'm like, wow, okay, this this has some some pretty high level things, but I think one of the mistakes he had as a podcast host when he was approached by someone who was competent is he went at the competence and said, oh my gosh, this person does all of these things, competent is he went at the competence and said, oh

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:47:42

my gosh, this

Chris Stone [: 00:47:42

person does all of these things and is bestseller and spoken on stages and all of these great things, but they didn't speak to his audience. They didn't serve his audience, and that was like the biggest mistake, that that he felt like he had made sort of to what you what you, what you had spoken about earlier. I don't know if you wanna touch on that or the piece about how you've you continue to look at PodMatch and and improving that in terms of the the quality of of hosts and guests there.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:48:09

Yeah. I I can actually tie both together because it really goes it's the same vision for for me. So, like, some something we do, what you're talking about is we we call it, like, a member purge, which most software companies literally like, I've been called crazy for doing that. They're like, yo, you if you ever want an investor, which we currently don't, but if you ever want an investor, like, you need to show big numbers. Right? Like, you need to get to a hundred thousand people using it. And we continuously every chance we get, we remove people. And now I'm not removing people that I'm like, oh, you don't have enough experience. You're out of here.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:48:34

Like, we don't do that. But people that are clearly there to do something with ill intent are they're gone. People that are inactive, they're stopping their show, they're gone. They they've gotta go. Right? Like, again, not trying to be rude, but we have to protect the quality that we have. And because we have a smaller tribe, there's as we're we're recording this, there's 15,000 people or so who use it, I think. And that's still a good number, but the important thing is for people to think about, like, hey, I don't want you just to brush through all these people really quick because there's not unlimited. You will run out if you do that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:49:03

The idea is sit with this person, their profile, and look at it and say, is this gonna really serve my audience? And we have prompts, especially when you're new. Like, right when you join, like, hey. Don't reach out to that many people that fast. Slow down. Did you look to make sure that this person is actually going to add value to your audience or vice versa? You can't just say, yeah. I wanna go on this show. It's like, do you did you take the time to to realize if you wanna go on the show? Did you listen to an episode? And so we've done our best to, like, work toward that behavior, if that makes sense, from the total number perspective and from the amount of actions you can take and from the different prompts that will just display on your screen for a limited time when you're new. All really important to us.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:49:38

And I think that it's key to having that successful show going back to the listener. Right? A listener doesn't wanna hear all things from all people. They are there because they wanna learn something about something specific that you've promised them. So going back to the show we're talking about, three day weekend. If it's not about how I developed that three day weekend, doesn't matter. Right? So it's gotta be focused on that. The more time we can encourage someone to take to make sure that that guest or host is gonna further that, the better.

Chris Stone [: 00:50:02

God. Yeah. That's that's that is absolute gold. I love I love that. Ladies and gentlemen, on your screen is the, the, the man, the myth, the wonder, the Jacksonville Surfer, Alex Sanfilippo, from PodMatch. He is, the co author, and he just admitted it took him six hours to do two books, which come on. Really? Six hours?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:50:28

I mean, for the community, I'm so thankful for the people that they've been watching because they they did better than I could have ever done. If I did all the time myself, it wouldn't have turned out half as good as that book those two books are.

Chris Stone [: 00:50:37

This is incredible. I think, I think it's a testament to to that community that it was like, we can do this, and, you know, clearly, it's it's it's a part of the DNA of why you're doing PodMatch. It's not just something to promote PodMatch. I it was something that I I very quickly early on realized, like, this isn't just a big commercial. Like, you can this is teaching you how to use PodMatch and how to do it well, but you could, like, just read it and never subscribe to PodMatch and become a better podcast guest Yeah. And a better podcast host. It talks about attention to detail. It talks about after a show, you know, promoting the episode.

Chris Stone [: 00:51:26

Ladies and gentlemen, before we went on, today, earlier today, Alex Sanfilippo sent us a video talking to us about how excited he was to be on the episode, how he was promoting it, how what he was gonna do in advance, and what he was gonna do after the show. That if you do that as a podcast guest, you are in the point 05% top percentile of all podcast guests because practically no one does that. And that is, like that's that's that's, like, white glove level service, Alex. So thank you for that.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:52:04

Appreciate it. That was because I got the cookies and, and orange juice. Yeah. I got I got those things in the mail. I figured I should send a video. No. But thank you for pointing that out. I think that's an important thing.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:52:12

Like, I do a lot of things that other people don't do. That video took me a minute and a half to record, by the way. I didn't or it took me a minute and a half. That minute and a half that I spent made me stand out in two legends' minds. Right? Like, as a guest, you can't think of all this stuff. And that's why grabbing a book like this, even if you don't grab it, like, at least take this to heart. Doing these little things make you stand out. And, again, I'm not saying, like, I barely put any effort into, like, sending that video, but it wasn't, like, four hours of my time.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:52:38

It was a minute and half of my time right before I walked out to go to the gym. Right? Like, it worked out just fine, though.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:52:43

It it's it's a it's a personal touch one, and and it it's funny. I I've done this sometime on LinkedIn. If you were to, like, type, you know, happy birthday, Alex, or whoever, and record the video, it takes the same amount of time, but I feel like the the video is that much more impactful.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:52:57

Yes.

Chris Stone [: 00:53:00

Alright, ladies and gentlemen. If you wanna follow-up, with, with Alex and with you can go to podmatch.com, but you can also go to alexsanfilippo.com, and that'll take you directly to his pod match profile, which I you know? And we're big fans of redirects, as as well and getting, getting where you need to. And if you're an entrepreneur, that is another little pro tip. Well, there's this this episode has been chock full of pro tips.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:53:25

Pro tips. That's what we should just title it pro tips. That's it. Pro tips. Let's

Chris Stone [: 00:53:29

do it. I mean, listen. We're in control of repurposing. We can call it whatever we wanna do it, man. We're in control of it. Awesome. Alex, thank you so much for, for joining us, for serving, not only, you know, continuing to serve serve the community that you have, but serving ours, and we appreciate you taking the time, sir. Any last words before we, sign off?

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:53:48

Well, first off, Chris, Jim, thank you so so much for having me. I love what Dealcasters does. This has become, like, a favorite of mine to listen to, especially in the gym because of the energy. Right? Love what you all do. Thank you for having me. The the final thing that I'll share is actually a a quote by by Helen Keller. Alone, we can do so little, but together, we can do so much. We talked about again and again how, like, these books weren't just written by me.

Alex Sanfilippo [: 00:54:08

Right? Like, I didn't spend a lot of time with it, but, like, look at what we accomplished together. And I think we've got to think about that. Like, as a podcast guest and host, you're doing something together to help serve somebody else. And I think the more we have that mentality of we're here to serve, we're here to help, we're better together, I think we're gonna drive this industry, even the livestream industry, just really far. And I think that you guys, once again, you guys are really great examples of how that works because you two together are better than either of you alone. And I just really appreciate, again, being here, and I hope that adds some value to people.

Chris Stone [: 00:54:35

Mic drop. Beautiful. Thank you. Don't fear the gear.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:54:40

Thanks for listening to Dealcasters. Congratulations. You've taken another step forward in your content creation journey. Please don't forget to hit the subscribe or follow button here in your favorite podcast player so you can be reminded every time we drop an episode.

Chris Stone [: 00:54:57

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Jim Fuhs [: 00:55:17

If you have questions about this episode or have something you want us to review, you can also email us at Dealcasters@Dealcasters.live. Thanks again for listening, and you know the deal. Don't fear the deal.