Unlock Your Podcast's Front Door With Dave Jackson!

Chris Stone [: 00:00:01

Joining us today is the one and only Dave Jackson who was podcasting while the rest of us were still figuring out how to set up Myspace pages and who's now in the podcasters hall of fame for teaching thousands of creators how not to sound terrible. Dave's discovered that most podcasters are losing listeners and money because they're treating their websites like digital business cards instead of what they actually are. Conversion engines that transform casual listeners into super fans and paying customers. Please welcome the head of podcasting at PodPage and our friend, Dave Jackson. Dave, welcome aboard, man.

Dave Jackson [: 00:00:41

Gentlemen, glad to be here. I gotta tell you, your opening riff as a guitar player, it's I finally just was like, screw it. It's it's in c. I'm gonna figure that. I'm like, I am playing that the minute we're done here. It's just one of those where there are certain things as a guitar player, you hear that. And like every like gene in your body's like must play riff now must play with. And I'm like, I can't, I gotta talk to Jim and Chris, but I will be doing that later.

Chris Stone [: 00:01:13

Amazing. And and there's a ton of folks here that are in the chat. Welcome here. Make anything easy saying woo hoo. Make anything easy. We haven't seen Jeff in a minute. So, Jeff, thank you for coming to the show. And, of course, James Hicks, doctor Hicks, the perfect timing since I was just he just asked you about this show earlier.

Chris Stone [: 00:01:33

Yeah. Dave, you you do a ton of stuff, and playing guitar was something like when I first, you know, went to Podfest and I was like, hey. Wait a minute. That's Dave Jackson up on stage playing a Santana song at a podcast conference. And then I kinda did a little recon and saw like, you had played guitar for years in bands. And I don't know, like, what, maybe three, four months ago, I saw you, you know, just decide you wanted to plug in your guitar, and you just shredded. You just, like, did this riff as, like, the start of a video or a short or whatever. And I was like, go.

Chris Stone [: 00:02:12

How long have you played, man?

Dave Jackson [: 00:02:15

Since I mean, I tried to play when I was five, but my fingers were too small, and I was left handed. And so I had a little plastic guitar, and that didn't work. And then my brother, who played the guitar strung the guitar upside down. And so I could because trying to learn because all the books were made for right handed people. So it was trying to, like, learn how to play the guitar in a mirror. And so I remember one day I was in first grade. I could not find a baseball mitt anywhere, and I could not find scissors. And I just went, alright, enough of this.

Dave Jackson [: 00:02:48

I'm not gonna be left handed, and I just quit. So, I mean, I was writing. I don't remember what I was writing with back then, but I was just like, I'm just done with this, which actually turns out to be really good if you wanna play the guitar because your left hand is the one that does all the noodling. And so I picked it back up when I was about 11 and played, you know, the classics, Jimmy crack corn, and I don't care, and she'll be coming around the mountain. And my brother's playing, like, ACDC stuff. And I said, like, I wanna I wanna do that stuff. And he showed me these things called bar chords, which means you can play chords all over the neck. And he said it was weird.

Dave Jackson [: 00:03:23

He goes, I just I showed you two chords, and he goes, and I came back in, like, a week, and you were already better than I was. And it was just a case where I just it's weird. I can hear something and kinda go like, I guessed. When I heard your intro, I go, I I think that's a c. So I don't have perfect pitch, but I I'm I'm pretty sure but I don't know. I know the last two are are, the yeah. And and I know the riff without playing it. So there's that kind of thing.

Dave Jackson [: 00:03:51

And I just I mean, my first gig, I think I was 14. And, you know, my mom was cool enough to where we had we had the station wagon, you know, green with the brown paneling on it. We drew all the gear in there, and me and my buddies went over and played a pajama party. And so Oh. You know, you you push the couch out of the way, and there's, like, nine girls in the pajamas. I think I made $10. Nice. I was playing some Tom Petty.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:04:15

Big man.

Dave Jackson [: 00:04:16

And I was like, oh my god. Sit. I know what I'm doing. You know? So over the years, I've just been doing it. And then the last band I was in was just a case where, number one, they called me reverend Jackson because I was the only person in the band that didn't have at least one because most people had two DUIs. And it was one of those where yeah. It was hilarious. When I joined the band, the drummer had a bracelet on his ankle, so it was kind of fun.

Dave Jackson [: 00:04:44

And we we got we got gigs because the, bass player was on the radio, but way, way Upper North Ohio. 1075, the Fox. And, so he would get gigs at places where he would do, like, live appearances, but we would literally show up and play to, like, three people. And it was like, this this really isn't that much fun. And, the lead singer moved to Florida, and that was the end of that. But, yeah, and that was, I don't know, probably ten years ago. So and now it's funny because when I call, I've I've tried to get back on other bands and be like, you know, electric blues band looking for guitar player. And I'll call and they'd be like, great.

Dave Jackson [: 00:05:23

And then I'll see in the ad where it's like 25 to 35 age. And I'm like Oh, jeez. Maybe six ages. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so and I was like, oh, man. I'm the grandpa now.

Dave Jackson [: 00:05:36

Because I remember when I was their age, but why is grandpa calling on our ad? And I'm like, oh, man. I'm grandpa now. So but, I I kinda don't miss it because you you I mean, on one hand, you don't the fun part is on stage, but you're really getting paid to lug all this crap around and Yeah. Put up with drunk people going, can you play Mustangs, Ali? You know? So that's always fun. So I'm always, you know,

Chris Stone [: 00:06:00

I was a musician as well. I I was. I still can can play it, you know, not to be dangerous. And I'm always thinking about how playing an instrument equates to what I do now, which is podcasting.

Dave Jackson [: 00:06:13

So Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:06:14

You know, what what did you learn from playing, you know, playing guitar in in historically through all the you know, maybe sitting in your room learning Eddie Van Halen or whatever it was. Like, what did you learn that you you feel like, oh, the the reason why I can do this is because of the things that I learned playing guitar?

Dave Jackson [: 00:06:35

Well, I think one of them is making a mistake on stage. That's always fun. When and I found out that if you don't grimace and make a mean face at the guy who did it or whatever, nobody knows you made a mistake. So just, you know and if it's if you're doing a lead, what's really cool is if you go and, like, what you do is you do that, note again and stretch it up this time to where the real note's supposed to be, and it sounds like you meant to do that on purpose. So there's you learn how to cover your mistakes Here we go. And kinda roll with the punches. So that's always kinda fun. And, for me, it's kinda weird being in a band is a lot of, and this sounds very woo woo kind of stuff, but there's an energy there.

Dave Jackson [: 00:07:20

I mean, I I still have, like, two big memories, and one was we're playing the song feeling alright by Joe Cocker. And it was just a case where everybody was in the pocket, and we had a full dance floor. And the singer just he came over to me, and he goes, I'm just gonna say, alright. Feeling good myself. He goes, we're just gonna repeat that. So we're making it up on stage, and he goes, alright. Feeling good myself. And I was like, okay.

Dave Jackson [: 00:07:45

My back one of my backgrounds is in choir. So I came up with a harmony, and then the bass player threw in a harmony. And we sat there and just did that for what was probably, like, two minutes, which is a long time to not really you know, the keyboard players tell the one his face off, but it was just fun to improv. And it was just the whole time, I'm like, oh, this is so fun. This is just the whole it's like the whole room was grooving. So I love the fact that when you kinda put out an episode and it's weird because it's not live. You don't have that live experience. But when you put out an episode and you wake up the next day and you have five emails saying, that was amazing, that's always fun.

Dave Jackson [: 00:08:20

So, you know, that and the thing I think that most people don't do is when you're a musician, you spend a lot of time in the basement. Right? I mean, it took I I think the last band, it took us, like, four months to learn, you know, 40 songs. And so it's not like I learned the the key c, you know, the chord c and went, okay. Alright. Who's gonna pay me money to play c? You know? You kinda have to build that audience up. And so, you know, I I think a lot of people maybe don't, you know, musicians call it woodshedding, you know, when you're kinda putting everything together. And instead, they figure out how to plug in the microphone, how to record, and how to publish, and then instantly do. And I'm like, well, don't you kinda wanna get your set together before you go public? And so, I always hear people they're like, yeah.

Dave Jackson [: 00:09:08

I'm I'm getting feedback now. And I'm like, okay. But, like, didn't you say you've already launched? And they're like, yeah. And I'm like, shouldn't you have gotten the feedback before you launched? You know? And they're like, well, this is how I'm getting my feedback. And I'm like, okay. That's that's a way to do it. Then not the way I would do it, but, you know, I would have done it beforehand so that your first impression is not one of, like, wow. That was awful.

Dave Jackson [: 00:09:29

Yeah. You know? So that that's that's something I've learned from musicians. So Do you do you do you

Chris Stone [: 00:09:37

feel like, though, like, there's there's that balance of starting messy, right, or start ugly from our friend Chris Karmitzos, and and then just sort of learning from failures, you know, fail fast and and sort of

Dave Jackson [: 00:09:49

Right.

Chris Stone [: 00:09:50

Get through that stuff. Because I think a lot of people kinda get stuck with that that that moment of, like, I need to put frames around this, and I'm I'm watching all these, you know, YouTube videos of podcasters and all this thing. And at and then they compare themselves to to these people, and they they never start. Or they start and and it doesn't happen, you know, immediately. Like, it hap doesn't happen for everybody immediately. And then they then they quit. And so so there's that balance of, you know, I you gotta start, you know, a little bit crispy around the edges because you you don't quite know. Right? But at the same time, you don't wanna start, like, you know, you know, with a phone in a in a basement either.

Chris Stone [: 00:10:35

Like, how do you how do you work with people to determine that balance?

Dave Jackson [: 00:10:40

I think it's you you start where you are with what you got and do the best you can. And there just comes a part where I was watching your intro, and when I went flying across the screen, I was like, oh, I was in the apartment in that because I recognized the backdrop. And I see people like, oh, your backdrop's kinda cool with the lights, and I got lights up in the scene, and I'm like, yeah. I didn't start here. Like, and there may be day like, I'm already kinda going, you know, I can lose the key lights and get one of those big lights with the the little cross things and the the you know, we're always looking at stuff. You always want one thing else. And so you kinda start with what you got, get it to the best you can, and and kinda go from there. Because otherwise, you're right.

Dave Jackson [: 00:11:20

You can just never launch. I've had people that didn't launch because they couldn't find the right music. And I was like, oh, come on. Can't we,

Chris Stone [: 00:11:28

you

Dave Jackson [: 00:11:28

know, can't we find something that's close enough to, you know, be okay? And they're like, no. It's really gotta be this or that. I'm like, okay. And then they just never find the right thing. Yeah. Wow.

Dave Jackson [: 00:11:41

So I I we're gonna we're gonna pivot into the the whole reason why we had you on the on on this podcast, Dave, is, you know, you obviously have, you know, a a ton of experience in the podcasting space. And when, you know, I got into it years later, it was like one of those things where you can create a podcast and you have a podcast host, and that podcast host gives you a website. Right? And you're like, oh, well, that's interesting. So you so, you know, you know, Captivate, Libsyn. All the podcast hosts will give you a website that has your podcast on it. Right? And Jim and I were somewhat specialized because we had the Amazon thing going on, and we were trying to drive people to the to the Amazon, place. But after a while, it was just sort of like, why are we driving people to this space that maybe somebody else owns as opposed to what our own, you know, sort of thing is. It's outside of just Amazon.

Chris Stone [: 00:12:42

And so, I wanted to start here with the whole conversation re regarding podcasts and websites is, like so when a podcaster says they don't need a website because their podcast is available on Spotify or their podcast is available on YouTube, what's your reaction to that?

Dave Jackson [: 00:13:04

Yeah. I mean, my favorite is if we go back to Facebook, I remember seeing television ads for, you know, build your website on Facebook. Just tell your friends to go to facebook.com slash, you know, Chris and Jeff. Well, okay. But then I've I mean, I've been kicked out of my own Facebook group. I went in. I do a thing every Friday called lunch with Dave, and I said, hey. Lunch with Dave starts in twenty minutes.

Dave Jackson [: 00:13:29

And I was banned from my own Facebook group, and it took me about a month and a half to get back. So there's that. If we go way back in the day, mp3.com was bigger than Facebook back in the day, and, I'm sorry. Back in the day. And, so, but there were musicians that'd be like, oh, just go to mp3.com/dave. And they had all these people go in there, and they were, you know, making some money on that. And then people uploaded things that they shouldn't have, and they got sued and sold and sold and sued and sued and sold. And it's nothing now.

Dave Jackson [: 00:14:04

And if you didn't have an some sort of newsletter or something, all these people are like, I wonder what happened to Dave. So, you know and then there are the people, like, I'm just gonna use Linktree. And I'm like, okay. That's that's that's a strategy, but there's just zero SEO. And I recently was working on a project, and I was asking people, hey. We'd we'd like to maybe partner with you. And they'd be like, oh, yeah. I I do this.

Dave Jackson [: 00:14:30

This would be great. I'm like, great. Where's your website? And they go, I don't have one. And I'm like, oh, okay. Because again, that that's a thing. And I'm like, how do you how do you get business? Because I'm kinda politely not wanting to go, you don't have a what? You know, what year is it? And, and they'd go, oh, I just you know, we just kind of operate on referrals. And I think so, obviously, you're doing really good work. Just think how much more work you would have if, you know, instead of, like, oh, here.

Dave Jackson [: 00:15:01

Let me write down his email address for you. And then it's on a piece of paper that they lose or what have. It's just like so, you know, when people go, you know, just anything. And if you think about it, whether it's Buzzsprout or Captivate, all those websites from the media host, they're not bad. They're a great place to listen and follow the show. Yeah. That that that'll work. And you're like, okay.

Dave Jackson [: 00:15:23

Great. And if I wanna have them sign up for my newsletter, not really. Okay. And if I wanna sell my book on that, well, kinda. You can kinda hack it. Okay. But what if I wanted to, you know, import my reviews? No. Not really.

Dave Jackson [: 00:15:37

You know? So it's it it gets you in the game, which is good because then you can be found. But it's when you're like, okay. Well, I'm ready to, you know, take this a little more seriously. And so and that doesn't mean Linktree or anything like that. That's that's just anything that's usually set it and forget it is kind of it's how's that saying go? It could be good, fast, or cheap. You gotta pick two, but you can't have three. Yeah. So I'm like, okay.

Dave Jackson [: 00:16:02

That's fast and it's cheap. It's just not very good. Well

Chris Stone [: 00:16:06

Isn't and, like, Linktree and some of these other things are are more like a response to, Instagram doesn't allow you to put links in stuff. Right? Or or Twitter or whatever. So here's something where somebody can, like, click on this, and then they get all of your stuff. But who actually is really clicking on that stuff? And then you're you're still not only are you, you know, building on rented land, you're actually building, like, a a rental on a rental. Like, it it's it you know, like, what happens if Instagram just decides to wake up and go, like, you can't do a link anymore here? It's like, now now you've invested all of this, which you think you're getting search engine optimization in, and it was really only built for one social media platform as opposed to something that you control that you can drive listeners to.

Dave Jackson [: 00:16:56

Yeah. And it's one of those words, like, well, it's it's just so simple and easy. And I'm like, okay. But can you, like, write something in Microsoft Word? Yeah. Well, then you can build a website. It's really not that you know, type new, write in, you know, call it about, write in your bio, and click save. There you go. And now let's make our you know, it's really not that hard.

Dave Jackson [: 00:17:18

So I always kind of like, why are you doing that again? Oh, just, you know, or they'll see some big influencer. Well, the big influencer already has an audience and maybe they don't need that, but again, they can have a bigger audience, you know, if they had an actual website. So it's, you know, we all have our own little quirks and, you know, but to me, I'm like, you're just missing the boat. It's really not that hard. So this Well, I know.

Dave Jackson [: 00:17:42

When you when you talk about this, this makes me think about, like, one of the struggles that when when people are talking about this in particular, they think that building or having a website built for them is, number one, difficult to do, and number two, expensive. Right? So they so they think, like, I don't know how to do this. And when I when I googled and I looked at Squarespace or or Wix or whatever, it it just even even though I don't know how to do a WordPress website or any of that kind of stuff, they think, like, it like, it these are this is more mind junk to keep people from creating and doing and building their their show. And so they just they just don't do it because they think in SEO and the witchcraft and and all of that stuff, like, am I getting found? All of that stuff, It keeps them from doing it. But what I found and what, you know, Jim and I, you know, use PodPage to you know, for our website because, a, it's easy, and number two, it it's not or, b, it's not that expensive. And, like, that was the thing that drove me to it was, like, okay. This is somewhat quick, really professional, and doesn't cost me an arm and leg. I'm not paying thousands of dollars to somebody to build my website.

Chris Stone [: 00:19:02

And then here you go. Here's the reins, and now you gotta learn WordPress to figure out how to change things on the on the fly. So if if we could, let's talk a little bit about how PodPage helps solve these these issues that you're talking about.

Dave Jackson [: 00:19:17

Yeah. I mean, for price, like, a really popular if if, again, you're kind of like, I'm I'm going for the next level up. I'm gonna take this serious. A lot of people talk about WP Engine, and it's a great WordPress host. It's also almost $60 a month by the time you buy the plan that has all the stuff you need, where PodPage has a pro plan for $30 a month, and it does everything and then some. And so my favorite with WordPress is I still have the school of podcasting is on WordPress because it's been there for twenty years. And, but I have to have Wordfence. Wordfence is this kind of security thing, and probably two or three times a week, I'll get an email.

Dave Jackson [: 00:19:58

Hey. There are a bunch of people in Germany trying to hack your site. And I just kinda go, well, I'm glad I have it, but it's another hundred and $50 a year. So, you know, you're like, well, that's what? 10 something a year. And then okay. But then I want, I forget the name of the one plug in I have for sharing stuff, but it's like another $50 a year. And then I use this other special plug in because it it turns out free plugins, while many of them are phenomenal, many of them then don't get updated because the guy's like, I'm not making any money at this. And WordPress is kind of fun because even though everybody kinda goes through some sort of filter to make sure that you've checked all the the boxes and it should work, that's just not the way it is because not everybody updates their their software, and they're on the wrong PHP or whatever it is in that whole nine yards.

Dave Jackson [: 00:20:45

So it can be a bit of a mess at times. And so you don't have to worry about, you know, a, the white screen of death, b, updating, you know, plugins. That drives me nuts. Every time I log in to my site and I don't have I don't have a little bit of plugins, but I don't have a ton. And every time I log in, something needs updated, and I'm like, okay. I do that, and then I pay even though I think the host I have has a backup, I still pay for an extra one. So it's just one of those things where the thing I love about it is it's just, Brendan came to me in 2020, and so I wasn't working there yet. And he said, hey.

Dave Jackson [: 00:21:20

I have an idea for for a website for podcasters, and he goes, what do you think they'd need? And I go, well, bare bones minimum, an about page, the contact page, and I guess our episodes. And he's like, okay. And he came back in about a week and said, like this? And I was like, woah. That is cool. I go, okay. Could you, let's see, integrate PayPal and maybe Patreon and, you know, make a page for, like, you know, to follow the show, and he came back in about a week. And I was like, that's amazing. And so it's funny because when he hired me last July, he said, you know, the one thing that's really gonna stink about this, and I go, what? He goes, nobody's gonna believe you now when you say PodPage is great.

Dave Jackson [: 00:22:01

And I'll be like, well, just go back to 2020. I go, I got, you know, plenty of free PodPage me working there, me saying how great it was. And so he really built it the way I advise you build a podcast, which is find out what your audience wants and give it to them. And so, you know, my favorite was I was at, podcast movement in DC, And we have a lot of built in things like slash follow. We'll have all your links to follow on Apple and Spotify. And slash sponsors will show all your sponsors and all this other fun stuff. And one of our customers came up. She said, man, I love this, but, like, you guys don't have a slash newsletter.

Dave Jackson [: 00:22:38

And I'm like, surely, we have a Slash newsletter. And I'm looking, and I'm like, we don't have a Slash newsletter. And so I texted Brendan. I go, we don't have a Slash newsletter. He's like, that's a really good idea. And probably within a week or two, we had Slash newsletters. So yeah. And so I love that kind of stuff.

Chris Stone [: 00:22:55

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. To for companies like that that are nimble, and it like, those are those are the ones you ride. Like, e e ECAMM comes to mind. This this show right here is powered by ECAMM. Dave, I know you use that for for your live streams as well. It's like you come up with an idea and you're like, my boy, I we're I really wish it would do that.

Chris Stone [: 00:23:14

And then all of a sudden, you know, you you're in there talking to Ken and Glenn, and it and it it's in the next beta. And and and so, like, for PodPage, it's the same thing. It's just, like, you know, obviously, they're not gonna be able to do everything that everyone is is recommending. But if, like, you can give it a good use case and, like, hey. Podcasters really need this, you know, to to monetize or do whatever. I wanted to do this because, our friend James Hicks is in the chat, and I wanted to pop up his, his question. By the way, Deb Eckerling is in the is in the house. Sorry we took so long to get to you, Deb.

Chris Stone [: 00:23:49

I hope you're still hanging around. She was talking about like, this is completely unrelated to what we're talking about right now, but hello, Deb. Thank you for, for coming on the show, former guest of the of the show. James Hicks is talking about this, and I and this is a perfect sort of segue into somewhat of a demo, as well. So he's curious about the YouTube video matching feature that's offered in the elite level, but I, you know, I think with James, like, we're at the pro level, just just full disclosure, like, Dealcasters in the pro level. And so when we put our RSS feed into PodPage, it matches our YouTube video. So, like, this show, when we post our podcast on Monday, the YouTube video will be embedded in our page as a part of the the pro plan. So, I you know, and I wanted to do this, Dave, is in you know, obviously, we're we're here.

Chris Stone [: 00:24:47

We're we're a live show, but we're also this is gonna be an audio podcast as well. But I wanted to do this just to kinda show everybody that's watching, and I'm gonna be as descriptive as possible. Dave, please help me out too and be as descriptive as possible when we're doing this. But when you go to podpage.com and you click preview your website, you can just go in here and type in whatever your podcast is. And I'm just gonna I'm gonna type in another podcast. I'm not gonna type in Dealcasters. We already have a podpage. But here's another one called Small Business Safari, and this was somebody that I talked to, as a prospective cast ahead client, and, it pops it in right away.

Chris Stone [: 00:25:26

So, like, the search engine, I don't know what you guys are using for that juice, but, like, you know, what you know, I type in whatever. If it's available as a podcast with an RSS feed, it pops up. And then when you click on it here, it asks you what email, you want it to to send to. I'm gonna collect, select mine, and then, like, let's just say we don't have a website, even though maybe small business Safari does. And I hit create website, and it will come up with 20 different variations of what your website can look like and how you can kinda go in and change. Now even if it just had one or two different types of variations for what PodPage can do, you can go in and change all of it. You can change hex codes. And I know James Hicks who had the question, He's like, you you can just say, James, what's your hex code? And he's gonna give you your his hex code right off the top of the dome.

Chris Stone [: 00:26:21

You know? And so branding is is super important to him. But you can see right here, small business safari. And look at all of the different designs for this particular show, that comes up with and let's just say we just kind of scroll down here and we say, okay, this oh, I like dark mode. So I'm I'm a I'm a dark mode guy. So I'm gonna choose this one right here. Say hi to your new website. And it's imported 229 episodes. It's giving all of this thing, and you can then start customizing from here.

Chris Stone [: 00:26:56

If you wanna turn off dark mode, you can turn off dark mode and go back to like, so all of this stuff is free for you to kinda see how it works.

Dave Jackson [: 00:27:05

Yeah. And you go through, and it's it's kind of doing marketing as you're going through as you're doing the customization, because it's kind of explaining, hey, you can also have this and you can do this or do this and you're like, okay, next. And then goes to the next one. And once it's there, I mean, we have like 20 templates, but really, you kinda just need one because all a template is like Chris said, oh, I love dark mode. So we're starting with, you know, everything black in the background or white text and things like that. Where later you could go in if you're like, oh, you know what? I don't want dark mode. Well, you could go in and change to a completely different template, or you could just go into design, colors, and fonts and go turn off dark mode. You know? And you're you're out of dark mode.

Dave Jackson [: 00:27:47

So all the templates are, they're a starting spot, and you just kinda go, oh, my podcast is blue too. I'm gonna choose this, or I want this or I want that. But, really, we only need one template. From there, you just kinda tweak it to however you want. And, yeah, it's, and then you get if you go all the way through and you make an account, that starts your 14 free trial. And how that works, for fourteen days, you have all the features, and you can tweak them and see however you want. And then once your fourteen days is over, if you haven't upgraded already, what happens is you can go in and tweak it on day 15, and you can see the website, but nobody else can. And the reason for that, we used to have a free plan, and then bad people did bad things on the Internet.

Dave Jackson [: 00:28:30

They would go into Oh. To movies, and they would film movies with their phone and do, what is that called? Bootlegs. They'd make bootleg movies and sell them. They'd get a free pod page account and then start to sell them to the point where it started to hurt our brand. It was like, oh, those are the bootleg people. And it was just like a bad game of whack a mole. We would just, you know, you'd delete them and they'd be back and this and that. So within with the fourteen day free trial, if you don't know if you like us or not in two weeks, then, you know, like I said, you can keep going.

Dave Jackson [: 00:29:01

It's just you can't go, hey. So and so, can you look at this link and tell me what you think of it because it's now day 17, and they can't see it. But if they're if they're behind you, they can look over your shoulder. So, yeah, it's pretty handy, and you can play with it that way.

Chris Stone [: 00:29:16

I love it too because you you integrate your RSS feed. So whatever you're using as your podcast host, it's gonna give you an RSS feed, folks. And so, that's that's the that's the gas pedal. Right? And so when you when you put your RSS feed in PodPage and when you release an episode, this is the beauty that it sets up for you. It creates this page for you. It creates a search engine optimized page on your on your website. It will give you, like, a short link for it. So, like, in the in this case, you know, next week, I think it's episode 72 for us, and it'll be, you know, deal caster slash 72.

Chris Stone [: 00:29:54

And so at the top of this page, you've got your video already embedded from YouTube. You've got your player that's already embedded. We use Captivate as our as our podcast host. And then all the stuff that you see here is is all customizable. So, like, this isn't just a template that like, we put all of these players on here. But, like, if you only want, like, a couple of these players, you can just choose a couple of players. And all of these things like featured episodes, like, your show notes that you're putting in here with all of your links are all clickable. Your chapters that you're you're putting into, you know, your your podcast from your from your host is there.

Chris Stone [: 00:30:32

You're you can paste your transcript into this as well. All of this is helping with search engine, optimization. This is like I know this is becoming a PodPage commercial here, Dave, but, I mean, like, we're huge fans of

Dave Jackson [: 00:30:47

it. But, like, you mentioned the featured episodes, and I never really thought about this. When somebody finds your website for the first time, there's a party that goes, oh, I hope they found me when I had a really good episode as as my latest one. Well, why not take your go into your media host, see what your most popular episodes are, and maybe put those at the top so that when somebody shows up, they're gonna find your best stuff. How How do you know it's your best stuff? Because it's got the most downloads. And so that's something I never really thought about that. And then you mentioned, if you put in your episode number into the, you know, episode field and whoever again you're using buzzsprout or captivate or whoever, we automatically make that short link. So that way, if this is episode, you know, 73, I can say, hey.

Dave Jackson [: 00:31:31

Everything we talked about, all the microphones, all this, all that, you can find everything at yourwebsite.com/70three, and we automatically do that. Now we we redirect to the page that actually has, you know, the typical SEO friendly this dashboard dash this kind of thing. So that's still there for your SEO, but we automatically make that short link to redirect to the the SEO one. That way, again, it's, number one, it, it reinforces your brand, all that stuff. We have a built in survey, and it's all you know, instead of saying, oh, go to mattresssite.com/dave or go to, you know, whatever insurance place slash, you know, s 0 p 20 seven x five, you just go, no. Go to mywebsite.com/sponsors, and everybody's on one page. And so they might actually go over for sponsor number one, but sure microphone thing, and then they click on that. So you're sending more traffic to your sponsors.

Chris Stone [: 00:32:30

Yeah.

Dave Jackson [: 00:32:30

So that when, you know, it's time to renegotiate that contract, the sponsor is like, where do I sign? You guys keep sending me more traffic.

Chris Stone [: 00:32:37

Yeah. It you know, so one of the tips you gave me, as a as a member of the school of podcasting, which we should we should mention, you know, as well, is, I is it Fathom Analytics? Is that right? Or is it, Yeah. So Fathom There's there's two

Dave Jackson [: 00:32:57

Fathom couple out there. Well, there's Fathom, yeah, there's Fathom, the the video thing that ties into Zoom.

Chris Stone [: 00:33:03

Right.

Dave Jackson [: 00:33:03

And then there's Fathom Stats at, use Fathom.com or check the show notes for, Chris and Jeff's affiliate, I'm assuming, maybe. If not, you should be. There's another one plausible. Yeah. Whatever you want because, I mean, nothing against Google Analytics. They will tell me what my visitor had for lunch last Tuesday on a full moon. Sometimes I just wanna know what's the most popular page on my website. Yeah.

Dave Jackson [: 00:33:27

And so I like fathom stats, but, there are alternatives and some people just hate Google. They're just like, I'm not gonna give Google anymore my information. I'm like, okay. So Right. But And we we we put

Dave Jackson [: 00:33:38

a blog on our on our pod page. So, like, we'll so, obviously, our podcast goes in there. But, like, we also do product videos. We'll also do you know, they demonstrate the PodTrak p two, which we talked about earlier, things like that. And, you know, I'll do a blog post and put it on our pod page, and then I'll go and I'll look at our analytics, and I'll see there's a bunch of people that are hitting our website. And I'll be like, where what what is where are they coming from? And you can see they're coming in via finding searching for the PodTrak p two and finding the blog posts that we made on you and and they're they're being driven into our website to, like, watch the demonstration of me doing the PodTrak p two and then, like, oh, maybe I'm gonna listen to the podcast that you guys were talking to Deb Eckerling on. So, I I mean, it's you driving people to your website, like, and being able to see that happen is is, like that's that's the grail. Right? That's what we wanna do.

Chris Stone [: 00:34:38

We wanna get people hanging out where we control things.

Dave Jackson [: 00:34:42

Well, that's it. When you have your actual podcast there, you know, when somebody goes, they they Google whatever it is. They find your stuff. And then if there's a player right there and they can click play, Google goes, that's funny. Every time we send somebody over to Jeff's side, they're there for, like, nineteen minutes. Like, that must be really good stuff. So they start moving you up the the charts of SEO. And it's just because you have a podcast or because you have a blog, and that's another feature that's part of PodPage.

Dave Jackson [: 00:35:09

But, yeah, because Google loves good words. That's where, you know, everybody thought transcripts aren't bad, but we don't write like we talk, and we don't talk like we write. So sometimes transcripts aren't you know, they're better than nothing. But if you haven't done anything to them, that that might not be the best strategy, but they're handy. But, yeah, it's, and anytime somebody comes up with an idea, it's like, oh, yeah. That's not it. You know? Because a lot of people want us to be a media host. We're not gonna compete with Captivate.

Dave Jackson [: 00:35:38

You know? People want us to be a newsletter. We're not gonna be Mailchimp or Convertkit or Kit or whatever they're calling themselves or, you know, we're not, you know, we're just we're not gonna be YouTube. We're not, you know, we don't compete. We we make pretty websites for people that don't wanna learn how to code, and then we just integrate with everything. So if you're on Patreon or Thinkific or whatever you're doing, you know, we can easily make a link to that.

Chris Stone [: 00:36:02

Okay. So that was the I'm I'm glad you brought that up. It's a excellent segue because, you know, profiting from your podcast, you're always getting asked about monetization. And so, you know, from a monetization standpoint in in PodPage, if if I'm someone that's like, okay. I absolutely I have to have a a podcast website. I've I've waited on this too long, but I also know that I'm paying x amount to do this. Can I use this to like, what are some first steps, I guess, to get some monetization going? Is it, like, get a buy me buy me a coffee link on your on your pod page? Is it, like, what are some, like, maybe some some easy quick win strategies for somebody that, is starting their website and people hit their page and they are listeners and they wanna know how they can help make this podcast profitable.

Dave Jackson [: 00:36:58

Yeah. So figure out what's what's a pain point for your audience, and it doesn't have to be war and peace. You know, maybe a page and a half. Come up with some sort of little, mhmm, lead magnet. And you can do that in Google Docs and then save it as a PDF, and then you can sign up for kit for free. They let you have, I think, a thousand members for for free. Mhmm. And you can basically go over and make your little lead magnet, copy the code.

Dave Jackson [: 00:37:26

This is as nerdy as it gets with with PodPage. You copy and paste. So copy and paste the code for the the sign up form. You go on a pod page and say, I wanna create a mailing list. Oh, I'm using my own. Here's the code. Save. And now when people go to your website, they'll see the, you know, here's my first name and my email address.

Dave Jackson [: 00:37:43

And when they sign up, they're actually signing up at whoever you're using for your email list because, you know, people talk about how the the riches are in the niches, but they're also in the newsletter. Because number one, it's almost like a friendship ring, you know, back in the days of junior high or whatever. I'm I I I'm giving you my email address. I I trust you enough to give you my email address. So it's kind of a it's a little baby commitment, and those are the people that when you say, oh, by the way, I've got a new book out. You can sign up here. Or these are the people that you can say, hey. I'm thinking of doing this topic in the future.

Dave Jackson [: 00:38:20

What do you think about it? Like, this can be your focus group because they've already said, I want more information from you. So that would be the first thing I would say. Start your newsletter because I know so many people that it they've been podcasting for years, and then they finally come up with an idea for a product. And you're like, oh, well, you can, you know, start talking about this in your newsletter, and they go, I don't have one. And you're like, oh, yeah. You should and they go, oh, yes. I should have started this three years, and I go, yes. Yes.

Dave Jackson [: 00:38:46

You should have. It doesn't mean, you know, if you can email on a regular basis, that's great. But if nothing else, just grab those email addresses because you will want them later if monetization is is definitely in the plan. I know, my first book I wrote, I had people on my email list. They were my editors. I was just like, okay. Who wants to read Dave's book first? Because it's gonna be full of typos and and all sorts of fun stuff. And so I had, like, five people, and I was like, okay.

Dave Jackson [: 00:39:10

I sent it to the first person, fixed those, sent it to the second person and the third person, and, you know, eventually, we found them all and, so but that was because they're on my email list. Those are again, it's they're they're you know, we pinky swore on something, and they're a little closer to me than usual. So that definitely would be one. And then there are websites like PayHip. I can never I think it's PayHip. If it's not PayHip, it's HipPay, but I'm pretty sure it's PayHip. And this is a place that allows you to sell, digital downloads, all sorts of fun stuff. You can sell courses over there, and the beauty of it is they don't charge you anything.

Dave Jackson [: 00:39:44

It is they take a now they take I think it's 5%, and then, of course, the traditional credit card stuff, so it's 2.9% plus blah blah blah, but there's no monthly fees. And so if you've ever wondered, you know what? I've I I thinking about selling this product, but I'm not sure if anybody really wants it. Well, build it or build the first half of it and then put it up for sale and see if anybody buys. And if they do, then you build the second half or something of that nature. But it's a great way to to kinda test an idea of does anybody want this? Now you can always email your your people and go, hey. I'm thinking of building this, but it is a way of kinda testing the waters in some cases. And then

Jim Fuhs [: 00:40:24

I I found it is pay it's PayHIP. So that that

Dave Jackson [: 00:40:27

is Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. PayHIP was I found that. It was like, wow, this is kind of cool. They I mean, it's really flexible and but they don't charge you anything. They just take a percentage. So they make money when you make money.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:40:39

Yeah. So, Dave, question I have is and you kinda hit on it earlier. Like, people get this Linktree, and the problem I think with things like Linktree, it's like you have too many choices. Right? Because you click that link, and it's like, what do you want me to do? And if we give people too many choices, they do nothing. So I think it's probably more important. I I think the beauty of PodPage is it is simple. I think that's where you guys have are onto something because it's like, hey, I just want to get my podcast out there. I want people to see what our content is about.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:41:11

You know, you're identifying, but there's a great look at your most downloaded episode. But how many I mean we hear this all the time Dave and I'm sure you get lots of people in the school of podcast and you're like, well how do I have people find me? Because the reality is whether you're on Apple or Spotify, I don't know that you're there. If you're even if you put a podcast out with, you know, thousands of downloads, I may not know that you're there.

Dave Jackson [: 00:41:36

Yeah. So this is Chris kinda already hit the nail on the head. Blogs come in really handy. Like, I just posted my episode comes out Monday, and I'm trying to get in the habit of writing a blog post on Wednesday that's much more detailed than what came out on Monday. And then I always have a link to the episode page, because Google loves backlinks. And so even though you're linking to yourself, that can help your SEO as well. And now I'm laughing because I can't remember what Jeff's question was. Oh, how do people find you? So there are things like Ubersuggest is a tool I use by it's a guy named Neil Patel who's a giant, SEO guy that's not as expensive like Semrush and a bunch of other things are, like, you know, they're big bucks.

Dave Jackson [: 00:42:22

And this I think there's a lifetime deal on it, and you can kinda go in and say, I do a show about blank, and it will go, here are some keywords. This one has a lot of competition and a lot of searches for it, but this one has a fair amount of searches, but not that much competition. And so it's not a case of hitting home runs all the time because it's hard because now I'm competing against Wikipedia and Reddit and all these other sites that just, you know, just crush in terms of SEO. But if I can find one of these kinda niche keywords that gets a fair amount of searches, but they don't have a lot of traffic because everybody's going for the home run, that's how I kinda at least that's my strategy. Let's find the I'll I'll go for a double and a triple all day long Yeah. And let you guys spend, you know, insane amounts of money trying to rank for those upper keywords.

Chris Stone [: 00:43:14

You know, Dave, you touched on this earlier, and this is the I think one of the in my opinion, anyway, one of the great differentiators of being able to to use PodPage as your podcast website is the survey function. And I I think a lot of for years, and you know this because you've podcasted since, you know, the microphone was invented. And, you know, you would you would, you know, sit there in your basement and record whatever the episode was, and you'd throw it over the fence and sit and pray and hope, like, it it resonated with people. Right? And there was really not, like, functional ways of being able to communicate with your with your audience and, you know, build community and and all of that. And I wanted to just kinda roll it over to you and just kinda talk about the the survey functionality that PodPage fairly recently, launched and and sort of the benefits to podcasters, utilizing that.

Dave Jackson [: 00:44:16

Yeah. It's if I go back to there was a time when Best Buy had all sorts of competition. It was Hyperstore and a bunch of other ones and CompUSA. And I remember CompUSA probably had the best prices, but the absolute worst experience. You would go in. You would say, I want that computer. They'd go great, and you'd give them a piece of paper, and then they had to go get, you know, Steve to go back to the back room, and he's gonna find you. And then, like, you're meanwhile, you're just like, alright.

Dave Jackson [: 00:44:46

Well, it's been, you know, fourteen minutes. What happened? You know? So and so, consequently, they were one of the first to go out of business because it was a horrible experience. Whereas if somebody had said, why don't you come to CompUSA anymore and be like, because it's a horrible experience. And then you get a chance to remedy it. You know? I remember once I went to a restaurant here at Akron, Ohio where I live, and they I love their bread, and they brought it to me. And I took one bite. It was like, and I go and the waitress came back over. I go, there's something wrong with this.

Dave Jackson [: 00:45:19

And she said, oh, they forgot to put the salt in the bread. And I go, okay. Like, can I get some salted bread, please? And so she did, and everything was fine. So I always I I scratch my head because somebody will say, well, I'm trying to grow my audience, and I'll be like, great. What did you learn when you did the survey? And they go, what do you mean? And I go, there's a survey built into, you know, pod page with questions from Tom Webster. You know? And they're like, oh, I I didn't even know it was there. But even then, after they know it's there, I'm I'm not quite sure why I maybe because we were afraid if we put it out there and say, what do you think, That it's all gonna be negative. Right.

Dave Jackson [: 00:45:59

And from my travels, it's rarely all negative. It's like, oh, I love this. I love this. I love this. This could use a little work. And it's it's funny because if you ask any podcaster to quote their one star review, mine is, a horrible show for a horrible product. I can quote that. Now ask me to quote a five star review.

Dave Jackson [: 00:46:19

Can't think of one. We love to focus on the negative stuff. But Yeah. The the best way to find out, you know, why aren't people listening longer than 38% when I check my Apple stats? Well, I don't know. Maybe ask the people that are listening. It's really not that, you know, and Yeah. It just my, one of my backgrounds when I got out of college first, I was a copier technician. And when you walked into the building where I was employed, there was this ginormous, neon yellow sign with giant black letters that just said constant improvement, And that was our mantra.

Dave Jackson [: 00:46:55

And so I've always just thought I can always make this better. I can always make this better. And one of my favorite people on the planet is Steve Stewart. And I just got to Podfest, I think it was. He's like, hey. You wanna go to lunch? And I go, yeah. Let's go to lunch. So we go to lunch and we're talking and Steve's like, hey.

Dave Jackson [: 00:47:12

Like, can I kinda, like, give you a little, like and I'm like, oh, by all means, let's let's do it? He goes, there are times when the curmudgeon kinda comes out in some of these groups. And he goes, you're he goes, the the patience is sometimes not he goes, usually, you're very patient. He goes, there've been a couple of times when, wow, David, and I go, dude, thank you so much. I go, that's I love negative feedback because it gives me a chance to improve. Because if we go back to the restaurant, you know, kind of, analogy here, how many times have you gone to a restaurant and the Coke is warmer than your burger? You're like, you know, and then you're you're checking out, and they're like, how was everything? And you're like, oh, it was good. And then you give them your money and you never go back. So the fact that anybody ever says, hey, Dave, do you know this was do you know you have ten seconds of nothing in the middle of your show? Like, oh, thank you. Let me fix that.

Dave Jackson [: 00:48:07

So, yeah, I'm always a fan of you know? And then the other thing is they are gonna tell you the stuff that they love. So you can do more of that. It's just the beauty of it. You know? And you might find out that, you know, you were doing the lightning round, and all of a sudden, but he's like, oh, I love everything except that lightning round. Well, good. Guess what? You don't have to do the lightning round anymore. And now you can focus on more stuff. So, yeah, it's, it's a head scratcher.

Dave Jackson [: 00:48:33

I'm not quite sure. Like, everybody, come on. Pick up your, courage and, you know, put out a survey. Your your audience will thank you.

Chris Stone [: 00:48:42

Well, yeah. It's like, you know, the the worst bosses I ever had were the ones that just said, hey, Chris. Chris. You're doing a great job. You know, five stars. You know? Just keep doing what you're doing. And I'm like, really? Like, you don't have anything that I could do to improve. Like and and so I think it's it that whole leadership thing, it's it's sort of like if if you want your thing to improve, you got you've got to surround yourself with people that you trust that will tell you how you can improve and and not and be ready for it.

Chris Stone [: 00:49:15

Right? I don't I I think sometimes, Dave, maybe some people just aren't ready to hear the honest truth in order to get better. Right? So if somebody were to say, well, you know, like, Jim and I, you know, we have this partnership and Jim will say, you know, hey, Chris, you say what not too much or, you know, you know, and and you gotta work on that, you know. Or I'll say to Jim, like, you you know, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna embarrass Jim. You know? Jim, you gotta put your shirt on during a live stream at whatever. And and so you know? But we do that because we want to improve the show, and we want to improve each other. Right? And then and so I think if you have somebody that's a that's a listener, that's a fan of School of Podcasting, or whatever, and you say, hey. Do you guys like this? Do you not like this? Because you don't really know. That's why you're asking it.

Chris Stone [: 00:50:11

And you might get feedback. You're like, holy crap. I didn't even know that this was a clunker. Nobody would nobody is gonna tell you that stuff outright. You know? This isn't Yelp. You're not, you know, you're not gonna get all of these people showing up and giving you all these bad reviews. You gotta ask for it. And it's so important.

Dave Jackson [: 00:50:30

Yeah. It's one of those things what if I ever meet somebody, they go, oh, I listen to your show. I'm like, oh, great. And I'm like, well, you know what's coming. Why do you listen to my show? And they'd be like, oh, I always learn something, and you're kinda funny. And I'd be like, great. What do you wish I would change? And then I just shut up. And there's this awkward silence.

Dave Jackson [: 00:50:45

Yeah. And sometimes if you let it go long enough, they'll go, well, that thing with the cat. I remember when I I used to have spots where my cat would interrupt. Yeah. And they'd be like, I'm not really a fan of Bernie. And I'm like, okay. Good to know. No more Bernie the cat.

Dave Jackson [: 00:50:59

You know? Or just at least you know? And and if I was in front of you and I had something to write down on or or pull out my phone and take a note, the body language is saying, hey. I'm listening. This is important. Whatever's gonna come out of your mouth, it's important. And so I'd always just listen. And on occasion, I'd I'd get somebody that would've like, well, this is kinda that and, you know, I'm not I'm somebody I always start off the it's kind of a joke. I go hit it, ladies, and then my intro music comes in, and somebody found that offensive. And I was like, okay.

Dave Jackson [: 00:51:27

Alright. Well, there's a name for you. It's called not my target audience. Okay. Good. Thank you, Drew. So, you know, it's like

Chris Stone [: 00:51:34

the other thing too is, like, when you solicit feedback, we're not for everyone. I mean Right. You know, like, our voices are not for everyone. Our our stances, our opinions, our, you know, our acumen. It's just like, some people just aren't gonna listen to the show. That's fine. You know, when you put yourself out there, you know, you and I, Dave, were in bands for years. So we know, like, getting on stage sometimes in Hattiesburg, Mississippi at Tals Dart Bar and getting a, you know, a a Schlitzmalt liquor bowl thrown at your head.

Chris Stone [: 00:52:03

Okay. I'm not for you, Bill, you know, here at at Tals Dart Bar. It it's it you know, so I built up that thick skin. But I think a lot of podcasters or people that are just sort of getting into this, YouTubers or whatever, when they hear that feedback, they immediately are just like, it just you gotta develop some thicker skin, folks. We're not for everyone.

Dave Jackson [: 00:52:25

Yeah. That's and that's really because we all wanna be loved by everybody, and you just have to realize. I have a friend of mine, Daniel j Lewis. And Daniel, if I were to describe he is mister detail oriented. Like, he will go a mile deep and an inch wide. Like, he'll find this one detail and give you everything you wanted to know about three zero one redirects. I will go with three zero one redirect. It's kinda like a change of address form for the Internet.

Dave Jackson [: 00:52:48

Right? It's like, that's all we need. This is what it does. Mhmm. Let's move on. And I'm kinda goofy. And so it's funny because Daniel and I used to do a show together. We still do. We do the future of podcasting, but we did another show with Ray Ortega called the podcasters roundtable.

Dave Jackson [: 00:53:03

And so we would have each other's audience go and check out the other person. And both Daniel had somebody that said, hey. I went and listened to your buddy Dave. And, man, that guy's, like, all over the place. He should win an award for ADHD podcast over the year. You know, that that kind of stuff. And and then I had somebody go, man, Daniel is dry as yesterday's toast. You know? And it's just that's just the way we are.

Dave Jackson [: 00:53:28

You either like us or you don't, and those people that don't, you know, here are 27 other shows about podcasting. Yeah. Have fun. So but, it's it's something that takes a little getting used to.

Chris Stone [: 00:53:40

Dave, this has gone by, like, ridiculously quick, and we haven't we haven't yet promoted, like oh, I'm I'm sorry. You're raising your finger. Go ahead.

Dave Jackson [: 00:53:48

I'm raising my finger. I gotta answer Jim's question because I never really did. Was it Jim? Doctor Jim? Yes. Because Yes. Because he asked about YouTube matching. There are two versions of of video stuff in PodPage. On the pro level, we'll make a page that has just your videos. And then the matching, we will basically look at the title of the episode.

Dave Jackson [: 00:54:09

So if you call it one thing in YouTube and another thing when it comes into PodPage, it won't match just for the record. Yes. So you the YouTube matching feature looks for the episode titles and says, oh, that's the same thing over here on YouTube as it is here, and it will actually add it to the episode. It it dawned on me at the end of that answer. I'm like, I don't think I ever answered James' question. Wow. You have

Chris Stone [: 00:54:30

a you have an incredible memory because I was like, I was ready to move on there. I was like, that that felt like yesterday.

Dave Jackson [: 00:54:36

I just didn't want James going, speaking of not liking people, that guy never answered my question. Alright. Continue on. You were saying how this flew by.

Chris Stone [: 00:54:46

No. No. This is absolutely flew by, and, we didn't at all talk about School of Podcasting, which, full disclosure, I'm a member. And everybody's heard previous episodes where I say go to s0p.dealcasters.live, and that will get you to School of Podcasting. That's an affiliate link. So you you heard me, FTC. And, this is a fantastic community. I can't wait for the call tomorrow.

Chris Stone [: 00:55:12

I wasn't able to do it last week, Dave. I was I was traveling for a for a family, wedding. And, it's a great community where we share about how to grow each other's shows and, unlimited coaching with the gentleman on your screen. Yes. Unlimited coaching. I've asked the most random podcast questions of Dave Jackson, and I get an answer, like, within hours. It's just it's a fantastic community and, just amazing value. So go to schoolofpodcasting.com.

Chris Stone [: 00:55:44

And then, of course, we we talked about, podpage.com. Dave's the head of, podcasting there. We set up small business safari, so, that was that was pretty rad. And then, of course, every Saturday at 10:30 eastern, this is the place to be. It's ask the podcast coach, and you can go to askthepodcastcoach.com. Just go to YouTube, every, you're on all the tubes though, Dave. Right? So but, like, the chat in YouTube is is pretty fun. Yeah.

Chris Stone [: 00:56:16

Every, every Saturday at 10:30, you and Jim Collison. I mean, I I don't know how much planning you guys do every Saturday. I feel like you guys have you you've got some questions that that there were asked, you know, or or asked via Reddit or whatever. But for the most part, it's like, this is generally where it's gonna go, but sometimes the chat takes it in all different directions. People join live. It's incredible.

Dave Jackson [: 00:56:39

Yeah. It's interesting because I'll I'll go out to Reddit and the, podcast movement and Podfest, all the different Facebook groups, and I'll look for questions. And it's kinda hard to find some that aren't the same. How do I start? How do I make money? How do I grow? What's the best microphone? Now I'm looking for something maybe a little bit outside that. Can I play music in my podcast? You know, those things, which is kinda hard, but it's always interesting because those are the weeks when I'm like, well, I've got two questions. I hope the chat room has something, and the chat room is always amazing. There've been many times when I've looked at Jim, I go, you got you got anything, Jim? And he's like, not really. And I'm like, alright.

Dave Jackson [: 00:57:17

Come on, chat room. You know? And, and they do. They they come in for us every week, so it's always fun. Yeah. It's a great time.

Chris Stone [: 00:57:25

Awesome. Dave, this has been amazing. Thank you for, making our show better and for for saying yes for the second time,

Dave Jackson [: 00:57:35

of

Jim Fuhs [: 00:57:35

In five years. Aboard.

Chris Stone [: 00:57:37

What's that, Dan? What's that, Dan?

Jim Fuhs [: 00:57:39

The second time in five years.

Chris Stone [: 00:57:41

Second time. Second time in twenty eight years, you know, for for coming aboard, Dave. Dave, I'm gonna let you have the last word, sir. Anything anything you wanna, say in order to send us off and, you know, related to podcast websites or, you know, playing guitar or your your love of King Zach's, the the floor is yours, sir.

Dave Jackson [: 00:58:03

Yeah. Oh, first, thanks for having me back. It's always fun hanging out with you guys. I appreciate the opportunity. Thanks everyone in the chat room for coming out live. It is so much more fun when there are actually people in the chat room. And, Yeah. If you, if you like what you hear, about Dealcasters or the School of Podcasting or anything we talked about tonight, please go tell someone because, that's how podcasts grow, word-of-mouth.

Dave Jackson [: 00:58:27

So and a little little tip of the cap to King's X because they're one of my favorite bands.

Chris Stone [: 00:58:32

Go tell San Juan. Ladies and gentlemen, as always, don't fear the gear.

Jim Fuhs [: 00:58:36

Thanks for listening to Dealcasters.